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Post by Deleted on Oct 19, 2016 19:20:35 GMT -5
there goes another one of the few decent ppl these forums had
i dont see why hate speech is seen as an 'opinion' its literally not. if someone was being racist, they'd be banned in a heartbeat, but if they're being homophobic its their freedom of speech and theyre ENTITLED to saying that ?? ok whatever i guess
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Post by shortstop on Oct 19, 2016 19:20:37 GMT -5
my two cents on this topic- i really apologize for the other Christians who can't keep their mouths shut. i identified as a christian for most of my life and it was issues like this that forced me to reconsider, a chapter I can't seem to pass. but please know that not everyone is like this. some of us are here to support you. there are christians who are fighting for that balance between this. some who are just struggling to make sense of it all. hell, there are christians off here and in real life that identify as LGBT themselves. there is never going to be a balance, as there are going to be christians that stick to traditional values. and even a smaller number of them will attempt to hurt someone who does not share those values.
but the problem is, a new rule to take care of this issue might fall under Christians, or LGBT, being silenced, which isn't okay. i strongly recommend something being done, but someone being included from all sides in order to assure that no one's rights are being violated. everyone in this community will have to treat this situation with maturity in order for ANYTHING to work.
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Post by Sand 🎃 on Oct 19, 2016 19:21:38 GMT -5
"...discrimination which is NOT condoned on these forums" would we allow a racist to have their words out in the open for everybody? i don't think so. i don't see how hatred against people based on their orientation is any different from hatred based on skin color. Brought this up once and apparently there's loopholes for it or so it seems to be. But, you know, I can loophole around it :-)
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Post by ⋆ ɑetɧeɾ « on Oct 19, 2016 19:22:03 GMT -5
OKay but what did my friend Spotty aka Washua say to you bc i know she doesnt hate the lgbt+
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Post by Sour Candy on Oct 19, 2016 19:22:06 GMT -5
Yeah...me and them never got along so I tend to accidentally come off as rude a lot of the time. I've seen some of your disagreements ): I can see why you'd be a bit wary of them. It'd still be nice if you could consider things a little more thoroughly, though. Remember not to contribute to a problem and things like that. Especially when it's self-harm related. If I'm coming off poorly on this subject, I'm sorry. I dealt with self-harm for multiple years and a few suicide attempts, so I'm sensitive to the subject. I hope you understand ): I understand completely. My girlfriend goes through that stuff too so I somewhat understand the subject.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 19, 2016 19:23:05 GMT -5
OKay but what did my friend Spotty aka Washua say to you bc i know she doesnt hate the lgbt+ ?????? "Not supporting" and hating are the same thing. I'm not explaining it again. Your friend Washua did this, and you both need to open your eyes about that.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 19, 2016 19:23:07 GMT -5
my two cents on this topic- i really apologize for the other Christians who can't keep their mouths shut. i identified as a christian for most of my life and it was issues like this that forced me to reconsider, a chapter I can't seem to pass. but please know that not everyone is like this. some of us are here to support you. there are christians who are fighting for that balance between this. some who are just struggling to make sense of it all. hell, there are christians off here and in real life that identify as LGBT themselves. there is never going to be a balance, as there are going to be christians that stick to traditional values. and even a smaller number of them will attempt to hurt someone who does not share those values. but the problem is, a new rule to take care of this issue might fall under Christians, or LGBT, being silenced, which isn't okay. i strongly recommend something being done, but someone being included from all sides in order to assure that no one's rights are being violated. everyone in this community will have to treat this situation with maturity in order for ANYTHING to work. " but the problem is, a new rule to take care of this issue might fall under Christians, or LGBT, being silenced, which isn't okay." lgbt are already being silenced we're used to it lololol but seriously if a new rule was put in place where christians couldnt spew their homophobic bs then the problem would be solved ???
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Post by Deleted on Oct 19, 2016 19:23:31 GMT -5
Also, I love how you guys just. Aren't going to apologize and own your behavior. That's real cute.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 19, 2016 19:24:36 GMT -5
"...discrimination which is NOT condoned on these forums" would we allow a racist to have their words out in the open for everybody? i don't think so. i don't see how hatred against people based on their orientation is any different from hatred based on skin color. Brought this up once and apparently there's loopholes for it or so it seems to be. But, you know, I can loophole around it :-)
....so one of the higher ups used a loophole in that rule to allow ppl to be homophobic ?? wtf
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Post by Deleted on Oct 19, 2016 19:24:49 GMT -5
Did something happen today?
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Post by Sanders on Oct 19, 2016 19:25:16 GMT -5
my two cents on this topic- i really apologize for the other Christians who can't keep their mouths shut. i identified as a christian for most of my life and it was issues like this that forced me to reconsider, a chapter I can't seem to pass. but please know that not everyone is like this. some of us are here to support you. there are christians who are fighting for that balance between this. some who are just struggling to make sense of it all. hell, there are christians off here and in real life that identify as LGBT themselves. there is never going to be a balance, as there are going to be christians that stick to traditional values. and even a smaller number of them will attempt to hurt someone who does not share those values. but the problem is, a new rule to take care of this issue might fall under Christians, or LGBT, being silenced, which isn't okay. i strongly recommend something being done, but someone being included from all sides in order to assure that no one's rights are being violated. everyone in this community will have to treat this situation with maturity in order for ANYTHING to work. i don't care about your not all christians or not all straights narative to be quite honest
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Post by Deleted on Oct 19, 2016 19:25:34 GMT -5
No one cares what your faith is. If someone is talking about LGBT you don't need to come ""defend your faith"", no one gives a crap. The people that do are already on the 100+ page you have. If you want to talk about how much you "disagree but don't hate us!!" go talk about it on your own thread You don't need to explain every 5 seconds on every thread you can in every possible way that you're against us, I get that enough irl
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Post by Sand 🎃 on Oct 19, 2016 19:26:13 GMT -5
Brought this up once and apparently there's loopholes for it or so it seems to be. But, you know, I can loophole around it :-)
....so one of the higher ups used a loophole in that rule to allow ppl to be homophobic ?? wtf I mean that we can get a rule done to get rid of homophobes The rule for that originally was done by Tomo, with not enough emphasis on it. Therefore, bye homophobes, I ain't gonna miss you.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 19, 2016 19:26:23 GMT -5
They just don't seem to care at all because it doesn't hurt them in any way.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 19, 2016 19:26:55 GMT -5
No offense, but guys: context.
A Christian not being allowed to say "I don't think LGBT people should be allowed to have rights" and LGBT people not being allowed to say "I don't trust certain Christians here" are wildly, wildly different things, because those Christians attacked us first, and we're just scared and hurting.
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Post by ⋆ ɑetɧeɾ « on Oct 19, 2016 19:27:18 GMT -5
OKay but what did my friend Spotty aka Washua say to you bc i know she doesnt hate the lgbt+ ?????? "Not supporting" and hating are the same thing. I'm not explaining it again. Your friend Washua did this, and you both need to open your eyes about that. I'm not trying to start an argument so I apologize if it sounds like it. But I'm just ??? Like how, bc i understand her non support for us and such but when i opened up about myself to her she was freaking very supportive enough. She didnt give me hate or discomfort or anything as I was expecting -- i expected something like that bc even though she is my best friend, she was Christian and like yeah. But she wasnt. So I know for sure that despite her non supportive-ness due to beliefs, shes not a horrible person and I have a right to defend her.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 19, 2016 19:28:16 GMT -5
The only thing that needs to be enforced is the Anti-Discrimination rule. Without any of those "loopholes".
There's no need to silence religions or LGBT+ people entirely. Just end the discrimination and everything is chill. Continue talking about your faith, asking for prayers, mentioning how cute your girlfriend is or asking for advice about binding or etc.
Just don't discriminate, and don't let the forums allow discrimination.
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Post by shortstop on Oct 19, 2016 19:28:56 GMT -5
my two cents on this topic- i really apologize for the other Christians who can't keep their mouths shut. i identified as a christian for most of my life and it was issues like this that forced me to reconsider, a chapter I can't seem to pass. but please know that not everyone is like this. some of us are here to support you. there are christians who are fighting for that balance between this. some who are just struggling to make sense of it all. hell, there are christians off here and in real life that identify as LGBT themselves. there is never going to be a balance, as there are going to be christians that stick to traditional values. and even a smaller number of them will attempt to hurt someone who does not share those values. but the problem is, a new rule to take care of this issue might fall under Christians, or LGBT, being silenced, which isn't okay. i strongly recommend something being done, but someone being included from all sides in order to assure that no one's rights are being violated. everyone in this community will have to treat this situation with maturity in order for ANYTHING to work. " but the problem is, a new rule to take care of this issue might fall under Christians, or LGBT, being silenced, which isn't okay." lgbt are already being silenced we're used to it lololol but seriously if a new rule was put in place where christians couldnt spew their homophobic bs then the problem would be solved ??? the problem is, that limits free speech. it is a statement in the christian bible, and if christians are not allowed to talk about it then that's a problem. it's targeting a single group. however, the reverse risks LGBT being targeted. it's not an open and shut case. both groups are important.
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Post by Haleigh on Oct 19, 2016 19:29:07 GMT -5
my two cents on this topic- i really apologize for the other Christians who can't keep their mouths shut. i identified as a christian for most of my life and it was issues like this that forced me to reconsider, a chapter I can't seem to pass. but please know that not everyone is like this. some of us are here to support you. there are christians who are fighting for that balance between this. some who are just struggling to make sense of it all. hell, there are christians off here and in real life that identify as LGBT themselves. there is never going to be a balance, as there are going to be christians that stick to traditional values. and even a smaller number of them will attempt to hurt someone who does not share those values. but the problem is, a new rule to take care of this issue might fall under Christians, or LGBT, being silenced, which isn't okay. i strongly recommend something being done, but someone being included from all sides in order to assure that no one's rights are being violated. everyone in this community will have to treat this situation with maturity in order for ANYTHING to work. i don't care about your not all christians or not all straights narative to be quite honest I don't understand exactly what you mean by this. Winter was trying to help. What they said was valid and supportive.
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Post by Sour Candy on Oct 19, 2016 19:29:13 GMT -5
"Not supporting" and hating are the same thing. I'm not explaining it again. Your friend Washua did this, and you both need to open your eyes about that. I know you aren't gonna listen to me but not supporting and hating are actually not the same
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Post by Saint Ambrosef on Oct 19, 2016 19:29:23 GMT -5
there goes another one of the few decent ppl these forums had i dont see why hate speech is seen as an 'opinion' its literally not. if someone was being racist, they'd be banned in a heartbeat, but if they're being homophobic its their freedom of speech and theyre ENTITLED to saying that ?? ok whatever i guess technically, hate speech is included under freedom of speech
however, since this is a private institution, the site has a right to monitor its members. they need to remain consistent on what they classify as okay and what they rank as rule-breaking, since I've seen a lot of variation on it.
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Post by tiger beetle on Oct 19, 2016 19:29:33 GMT -5
" but the problem is, a new rule to take care of this issue might fall under Christians, or LGBT, being silenced, which isn't okay." lgbt are already being silenced we're used to it lololol but seriously if a new rule was put in place where christians couldnt spew their homophobic bs then the problem would be solved ??? the problem is, that limits free speech. it is a statement in the christian bible, and if christians are not allowed to talk about it then that's a problem. it's targeting a single group. however, the reverse risks LGBT being targeted. it's not an open and shut case. both groups are important. "do not talk about hating people" is not the same as "do not talk about your religion" in the slightest
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Post by Deleted on Oct 19, 2016 19:29:42 GMT -5
I know I'm the least qualified person to respond to this, and I pray I don't stir up more drama, but you don't know how sorry I am that we've made you feel this way. I don't hate you, nor do I hate anybody else on this site. My intention was never to make you feel bad about yourself or hurt you, and neither, I don't think, was anyone else's- I was just trying to defend my faith's position, not tell you that you should or shouldn't live your life however you want. And I should have just stopped that after the first big fight I was involved in, especially since I don't often have the best control over my tongue. Again, I'm incredibly sorry that you feel this way, and I know you won't forgive me, but I must say it. I hope and pray that you find happiness and peace, wherever you go. Best of luck ❤️ I hope you understand how serious this is and always has been. I truly, honestly do. Your homophobia - and yes, it is homophobia - has a tangible, real-life effect on people, and you do immeasurable harm every time you open your moth about it. I hope this changes things. Do I think it will? Not really, but I hope I'm wrong.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 19, 2016 19:29:47 GMT -5
" but the problem is, a new rule to take care of this issue might fall under Christians, or LGBT, being silenced, which isn't okay." lgbt are already being silenced we're used to it lololol but seriously if a new rule was put in place where christians couldnt spew their homophobic bs then the problem would be solved ??? the problem is, that limits free speech. it is a statement in the christian bible, and if christians are not allowed to talk about it then that's a problem. it's targeting a single group. however, the reverse risks LGBT being targeted. it's not an open and shut case. both groups are important. i literally dont care about your free speech i just dont so stop
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Post by Deleted on Oct 19, 2016 19:30:34 GMT -5
If you can't talk about your religion without being hateful, then you must not think very highly of your religion.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 19, 2016 19:31:15 GMT -5
"Not supporting" and hating are the same thing. I'm not explaining it again. Your friend Washua did this, and you both need to open your eyes about that. I know you aren't gonna listen to me but not supporting and hating are actually not the same Refusing to support and hating someone/something can come off pretty similarly, even if the definitions are different. For example: I don't support, say, the legalization of marijuana. Therefore, I would vote against it. People that hate it will also vote against it. The same thing is happening in both groups.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 19, 2016 19:31:31 GMT -5
"Not supporting" and hating are the same thing. I'm not explaining it again. Your friend Washua did this, and you both need to open your eyes about that. I know you aren't gonna listen to me but not supporting and hating are actually not the same You're right. I'm not listening. What happened here tonight is serious, and you letting your petty hatred of Verbatim guide the conversation is deplorable.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 19, 2016 19:32:07 GMT -5
there goes another one of the few decent ppl these forums had i dont see why hate speech is seen as an 'opinion' its literally not. if someone was being racist, they'd be banned in a heartbeat, but if they're being homophobic its their freedom of speech and theyre ENTITLED to saying that ?? ok whatever i guess technically, hate speech is included under freedom of speech
however, since this is a private institution, the site has a right to monitor its members. they need to remain consistent on what they classify as okay and what they rank as rule-breaking, since I've seen a lot of variation on it.
freedom of speech means you cant get arrested for saying whatever. this is a forum, as u say, so idc if they limit what u can say
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Post by Sanders on Oct 19, 2016 19:32:12 GMT -5
i don't care about your not all christians or not all straights narative to be quite honest I don't understand exactly what you mean by this. Winter was trying to help. What they said was valid and supportive. coming on here to say "NOT ALL CHRISTIANS ARE BAD" or "NOT ALL STRAIGHTS ARE BAD" is not really that supportive. it's absolving yourself of guilt to say you're one of the "good allies." also that narrative opens up for others who do actually hate LGBT to be like "well im one of the ones who isn't bad because not all of us are bad and im the good one" you get away with so much more with this narrative. so i don't really care for them to come here and say that not all people are like that because a) i already know not all people are bad and it doesn't help the conversation of the people who are bad.
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Post by Sour Candy on Oct 19, 2016 19:32:59 GMT -5
I know you aren't gonna listen to me but not supporting and hating are actually not the same You're right. I'm not listening. What happened here tonight is serious, and you letting your petty hatred of Verbatim guide the conversation is deplorable. ??? This was like the first time I joined in on the actual conversation though how am I "guiding" it
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