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Post by Poppysong on Sept 17, 2023 11:58:41 GMT -5
What do you guys think? I think that he was a good leader in TBC, but taking over RiverClan, he has gone to far.
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Post by แฆฯ๊ ธแฅด๊ซแ ป๊ช๊ชแง on Sept 17, 2023 12:01:24 GMT -5
Absolutely not.
I hate him anyways so Iโm incredibly biased lol
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Post by ๐ฑ๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐ on Sept 17, 2023 12:15:12 GMT -5
Overall a big nope to Tigerstar II as leader from me.
He was fine in TBC for letting all of the wrongfully exiled cats stay in his camp and then in the abandoned SkyClan camp on his territory (minus him trying to get Shadowsight out of camp and to the tribe after he had been imprisoned due to letting Ashfur escape) but that was it.
He has sucked ever since then and before that (especially in his relationship with Dovewing and how he is currently treating RiverClan though but how he went after SkyClan and the Sisters was also bad).
Of all the current leaders, he really deserves to either die or get outvoted (or overthrown) the most.
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Post by ๐ฃ๐ฒ๐ท๐พ๐ฟ๐ฒ๐ฎ๐ต on Sept 17, 2023 13:42:03 GMT -5
*laughs in SkyClan* No! No, he's not! He's really living up to his namesake and that is not a compliment. I also wish people would stop trying to justify his takeover of RiverClan.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 17, 2023 14:09:19 GMT -5
A stick stuck in quicksand makes for a better leader than Tigerstar II, at least morally. It literally leaves me at a loss for words seeing people try and defend his actions towards Riverclan. I hope he gets voted out of leadership.
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Post by ๐ฑ๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐ on Sept 17, 2023 14:24:16 GMT -5
Alright, who voted the yes option?!
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Post by Hollyfall on Sept 17, 2023 14:28:21 GMT -5
The only good things during his reign so far have been restoring ShadowClan and standing up to Ashfur's nonsense while taking in the exiled cats and giving them a place to stay, while also helping the rebels. Otherwise he's impulsive and biased. Thank god there's much more sensible cats in ShadowClan than he is.
The first thing he does as leader is start a war with SkyClan over territory he gave them, then he proceeds to forcefully drive out the Sisters even after being told their leader is expecting kits. Not to mention when he shows up on RiverClan's doorstep, attempts to use show of force to take up their leadership, and when that doesn't work, beats them into submission to make them subservient to ShadowClan while also doing absolutely nothing to govern the Clan? He tries to "help" them without bothering to consult the other Clans. Like sure, in his mind he's "helping", but everyone else can see it for what it really is.
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Post by Hollyfall on Sept 17, 2023 14:33:36 GMT -5
I also wish people would stop trying to justify his takeover of RiverClan. This one baffles me because while sure, he believes he's doing the right thing, it's kind of obvious in the narrative that he's overstepped his authority. There's literally plots in both of the Clans he's overseeing to remove his influence from RiverClan. Not to mention the other leaders agreeing he took things too far.
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Post by Moonblazer on Sept 17, 2023 14:39:22 GMT -5
Literally any cat ever would be a better leader than this authorโs pet pile of dogwater garbage of a cat that genuinely ruined Warriors as a series for me. His hypocrisy, his invasion of Riverclan, the way heโs written in that heโll inevitably get away with anything that he does with minimal consequences, his awful romance, everything about him makes him such an awful leader to read about. At least cats like Onestar that caused conflict were interesting and werenโt painted out as heroes, but Tigerheart gets more free passes than any other character I know, and the only way he gets elevated as a character is by making other characters crumble apart and look meek in comparison.
Awful character, awful leader, somebody please kill him off so we can get Cloverstar.
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Post by ๐ฃ๐ฒ๐ท๐พ๐ฟ๐ฒ๐ฎ๐ต on Sept 17, 2023 14:47:50 GMT -5
I also wish people would stop trying to justify his takeover of RiverClan. This one baffles me because while sure, he believes he's doing the right thing, it's kind of obvious in the narrative that he's overstepped his authority. There's literally plots in both of the Clans he's overseeing to remove his influence from RiverClan. Not to mention the other leaders agreeing he took things too far. Honestly, and maybe it's because I'm a WoC, but people saying that Tigerstar was justified (be it due to grief or because Duskfur attacked first) really hits hard for me. It's not supposed to be that deep, but at the same time, replace Tigerstar with any real life oppressor and yikes. Furthermore, he came into RiverClan's camp at night with an army! What else was RiverClan supposed to do? They needed help and Mothwing should've been more mindful of the herbs she had in her store, but this definitely wasn't the way to go!
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Post by ๐๐ถโจBrambleheartโจ๐ถ๐ on Sept 17, 2023 15:08:34 GMT -5
His leadership was very promising at the beginning as the force that brought ShadowClan back together, but it has been falling downhill ever since. At least ShadowClan is more stable that under Rowanstar's leadership.
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Post by ๐๐ถโจBrambleheartโจ๐ถ๐ on Sept 17, 2023 15:10:35 GMT -5
Literally any cat ever would be a better leader than this authorโs pet pile of dogwater garbage of a cat that genuinely ruined Warriors as a series for me. His hypocrisy, his invasion of Riverclan, the way heโs written in that heโll inevitably get away with anything that he does with minimal consequences, his awful romance, everything about him makes him such an awful leader to read about. At least cats like Onestar that caused conflict were interesting and werenโt painted out as heroes, but Tigerheart gets more free passes than any other character I know, and the only way he gets elevated as a character is by making other characters crumble apart and look meek in comparison. Awful character, awful leader, somebody please kill him off so we can get Cloverstar. Somehow the newest leader has already outstayed his welcome, how funny! Praying that the new rule gets Tigerstar 2 stepped down. Cloverstar 2024
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Post by iceheart on Sept 17, 2023 19:39:22 GMT -5
No. He's arrogant, hardheaded, only cares about his family and himself. He can't put his Clan above his family, and that's what makes him terrible. He doesn't tolerate any views that aren't his own and he can't coexist with the other Clans. He's not leaderlike material and he didn't deserve to "be revived because he was the only cat who could bring ShadowClan back." The only reason he was fighting against the impostor was because (and this is a serious line) Tawnypelt reminded him that the impostor threatened to revoke his leadership.
Also, he killed Leafpool. He... literally killed Leafpool (and Moonlight). And not a single person said a thing about it.
Other than that, he's a hypocrite. He started a war with SkyClan in The Raging Storm for land that *he* gave them while he was still Rowanclaw's deputy. He tried to get Shadowsight out of camp during The Broken Code, showing that he can't put his Clan above his family. He was so hellbent on killing the impostor, but suddenly when Shadowsight is responsible for letting the impostor live, then everyone else is wrong. Everyone else is wrong and Tigerheart is right. He started an unnecessary war against the Sisters because of his greed and selfishness. Now he's trying to take over RiverClan, and he can paint it and say that his intentions are well-meaning, but he threatened to kill Duskfur if they didn't surrender. This is not a leader. This is not "a cat who made ShadowClan great." He's a piece of editor-worshipped garbage, and he makes his namesake proud, I'm sure. The only thing that can salvage this arc is him being overthrown by the new warrior code, or him dying. Other than that, he's terrible. There's nothing redeeming about his leadership. ShadowClan was made to fall apart by the editors so they could kick Rowanclaw out and make Tigerheart leader.
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Post by ยฏ\_(ใ)_/ยฏIvyStarยฏ\_(ใ)_/ยฏ on Sept 17, 2023 21:16:18 GMT -5
No. Definitely no. The way he involves his family in every little thing and doesn't allow anybody who isn't in his family to do important things. He also took over RiverClan because they don't have a leader. RiverClan can manage by themselves! I totally agree with Squirrelflight and Leafstar. Tigerstar II could end up doing what Tigerstar I did.
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Post by nowarriornameshere on Sept 17, 2023 21:47:04 GMT -5
No. I like him more than most, but no. He has repeatedly made decisions that favor his family over his clan and will do so without a second thought. That simply is not a quality that a good leader should have. I respect him as a family man, but if you can't put the group you're the leader of before your family, you either shouldn't have a family or you shouldn't be the leader.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 17, 2023 22:08:14 GMT -5
No. I like him more than most, but no. He has repeatedly made decisions that favor his family over his clan and will do so without a second thought. That simply is not a quality that a good leader should have. I respect him as a family man, but if you can't put the group you're the leader of before your family, you either shouldn't have a family or you shouldn't be the leader. I think it's interesting that this exact reason is why medicine cats aren't allowed to have a mate or kits... And yet with Tigertwo and Squirrelflight (Squilf putting her love for Bramblestar over the clan's wellbeing) I feel we have more examples of high ranks like deputy and leader having more a problem with this than the medicine cats ever have. Even the ones that have had kits. Bar Moth Flight, I guess lmao.
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Post by dahliadove - #1 nightpelt fan on Sept 18, 2023 6:02:45 GMT -5
if nightstar was alive he wouldn't stand for his behaviour
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Post by nowarriornameshere on Sept 18, 2023 10:22:48 GMT -5
No. I like him more than most, but no. He has repeatedly made decisions that favor his family over his clan and will do so without a second thought. That simply is not a quality that a good leader should have. I respect him as a family man, but if you can't put the group you're the leader of before your family, you either shouldn't have a family or you shouldn't be the leader. I think it's interesting that this exact reason is why medicine cats aren't allowed to have a mate or kits... And yet with Tigertwo and Squirrelflight (Squilf putting her love for Bramblestar over the clan's wellbeing) I feel we have more examples of high ranks like deputy and leader having more a problem with this than the medicine cats ever have. Even the ones that have had kits. Bar Moth Flight, I guess lmao. I hadn't thought of the Moth Flight and medicine cat parallel, but that's pretty on the money. Definitely part of why I wouldn't mind if Tigerstar got impeached or Squirrelflight got barred from becoming leader at all.
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Post by {Azure} on Sept 18, 2023 10:30:22 GMT -5
owlnose was better
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Post by Hollyfall on Sept 18, 2023 15:34:12 GMT -5
I like the guy but...not really. He himself recognised he wasn't leader material. Icewing is doing a better job even though she's essentially a puppet leader subservient to Tigerstar.
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Post by {Azure} on Sept 18, 2023 15:49:12 GMT -5
I like the guy but...not really. He himself recognised he wasn't leader material. Icewing is doing a better job even though she's essentially a puppet leader subservient to Tigerstar. yea i love him just not as a leader, i was just joking
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Post by iceheart on Sept 18, 2023 19:59:38 GMT -5
Owlnose, and I'm quoting Mothwing on this one, wanted to make decisions that would make everyone happy. Tigerheart only makes decisions that benefit himself and his family. So I agree with you that Owlnose is better. Owlnose might not be incredibly decisive, but if being a "true leader" means being a complete and utter jerk, then I'd rather have Owlnose over Tigerheart.
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#add8e6
Name Colour
*Ravenpaw*
Warrior Fanatic
*reads books in a corner*
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Post by *Ravenpaw* on Sept 18, 2023 21:47:25 GMT -5
Other than taking in Mistystar's exiled warriors and medicine cat, no. His leadership is like the sound of nails on a chalkboard. >.< The whole cat needs to go.
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Post by Violet6Echoes on Sept 20, 2023 6:36:49 GMT -5
No heโs really not. And I think people out there who think he do just donโt understand that the only reason he was the good guy in TBC was because 1. He didnโt like being told what to do and 2. He isnโt as attached to the code as the other leaders.
Heโs not the good guy- the second after TBC ends heโs back to being the villain. Ppl just got attached to how they saw him in TBC and his relationship with Dovewing (that they think is good btw???) and then go around saying โoh everyone is so wrong about this guy.โ
If he doesnโt get voted off I will be seriously disappointed and I MIGHT actually make a rewrite of this series just to make it so he does. I donโt hate him- heโs an interesting character- but I just get annoyed with his defenders and how they decided to use a character that was named to try to prove โTigerโ didnโt mean bad to fit this role.
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Post by iceheart on Sept 20, 2023 8:16:36 GMT -5
No heโs really not. And I think people out there who think he do just donโt understand that the only reason he was the good guy in TBC was because 1. He didnโt like being told what to do and 2. He isnโt as attached to the code as the other leaders. Heโs not the good guy- the second after TBC ends heโs back to being the villain. Ppl just got attached to how they saw him in TBC and his relationship with Dovewing (that they think is good btw???) and then go around saying โoh everyone is so wrong about this guy.โ If he doesnโt get voted off I will be seriously disappointed and I MIGHT actually make a rewrite of this series just to make it so he does. I donโt hate him- heโs an interesting character- but I just get annoyed with his defenders and how they decided to use a character that was named to try to prove โTigerโ didnโt mean bad to fit this role. This 1000x. Tigerheart didn't protest against the impostor because he cared about the warrior code or he thought something was off with Bramblestar. He doesn't care about the warrior code, but mostly it was because Bramblestar said he could despose him as leader. The literal exchange was as following: Tawnypelt nodded. "He threatened to replace you with another leader, remember?" Tigerstar met the tortoiseshellโs clear, green gaze and held it for a moment. Then he dipped his head. โYouโre right.โ He looked around at his warriors. โThis isnโt something we can ignore. ThunderClan needs its rightful leader back for all our sakes.โ He says that ThunderClan needs its rightful leader back, but he only started to protest when Tawnypelt mentioned the whole replacing leader thing. Had it not been for that, he wouldn't give a damn. And if the editors even knew who Mistystar was, or bothered reading the arcs they didn't write, I'm 100% sure Mistystar would've protested against the impostor's rule because Mistystar knows who the actual Bramblestar is.
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Non-binary
Gladeshadow
The Warriors Nostalgia is strong in this one.
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Post by Gladeshadow on Sept 23, 2023 13:50:06 GMT -5
I'm coming into this a little backwards. I hadn't read any of POT since book 3 and none of OOTS when I began reading VOS and as soon as he 360'd giving the land to Skyclan I was very confused why they suddenly made him evil. So I'm more disappointed in the Erin's to keep this 'all Tigerstar's male descendents are prone to evil" bs.
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Post by ๐ฃ๐ฒ๐ท๐พ๐ฟ๐ฒ๐ฎ๐ต on Sept 23, 2023 13:58:43 GMT -5
I'm coming into this a little backwards. I hadn't read any of POT since book 3 and none of OOTS when I began reading VOS and as soon as he 360'd giving the land to Skyclan I was very confused why they suddenly made him evil. So I'm more disappointed in the Erin's to keep this 'all Tigerstar's male descendents are prone to evil" bs. Honestly, you're not missing much. There just wasn't any build-up to his personality change at all; even in his own SE, where it would've been most relevant, he's nowhere near as aggressive as he usually is now. The only thing that stayed consistent was him being protective of his family.
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Post by ๐ฉถSilverspark๐ฉถ on Sept 23, 2023 14:21:16 GMT -5
Alright, who voted the yes option?! I did. He cares about his clan, idc what else he does. I havenโt read asc yet does he do any other dumb shit?
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Non-binary
Gladeshadow
The Warriors Nostalgia is strong in this one.
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Post by Gladeshadow on Sept 23, 2023 14:23:55 GMT -5
I'm coming into this a little backwards. I hadn't read any of POT since book 3 and none of OOTS when I began reading VOS and as soon as he 360'd giving the land to Skyclan I was very confused why they suddenly made him evil. So I'm more disappointed in the Erin's to keep this 'all Tigerstar's male descendents are prone to evil" bs. Honestly, you're not missing much. There just wasn't any build-up to his personality change at all; even in his own SE, where it would've been most relevant, he's nowhere near as aggressive as he usually is now. The only thing that stayed consistent was him being protective of his family. It really feels like they made him evil for the sake of it. We really couldn't have a nice Tigerstar could we?
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#E0C6FF
Name Colour
Slightdapple
โจyour local book nerd โจ
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Post by Slightdapple on Sept 23, 2023 14:34:25 GMT -5
No.
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