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Post by Goldy from Dappleclan on Sept 27, 2021 16:18:49 GMT -5
wcrpforums.com/thread/85412/riverstar-se?page=1So I created this thread back when Riverstar was losing to Ivypool. I was really annoyed at the idea of an Ivypool SE which is why I urged Riverstar fans to gather up more votes. I also planned on making a raffle to get more votes. (Something I never bothered doing in the end). I just checked the thread and it has 5 pages of people posting things and was apparently locked by a moderator because of people insulting eachother. I just wanted to apologize for starting the thread. My intentions were originally good, I assumed that most people were just as annoyed as I was that Ivypool would get a "pointless", "boring" SE instead of more DOTC content, which we've been waiting years for. Pretty sad that it devolved so fast, I'm also sad to hear that certain people have been using bots to cheat and ruin the poll. At this point I don't mind if Ivypool wins, just wanted to apologize to you all. Hopefully we can all learn from this and not hold anything against eachother for the way that the entire thread went down.
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Post by Goldy from Dappleclan on Sept 27, 2021 16:34:00 GMT -5
On the positive side perhaps the Warriors people will have noticed how much love and passion the fandom has for both Riverstar and Ivypool - and maybe we'll get two SEs with them.
Also I just noticed Moonkitti participated in my thread and posted it on Twitter. I'm so honoured right now. Hi Moonkitti.
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Post by Midnightcacoon loves Sunbeam on Sept 27, 2021 16:40:18 GMT -5
I thought your original post was pretty fun, it's not your fault it ended up the way it did. Hopefully whoever comes out victorious that its a good SE Also I did not know moonkitti was on the forums, that was pretty cool
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Post by Midnightcacoon loves Sunbeam on Sept 27, 2021 16:45:26 GMT -5
Moonblazer Hey, this is what got the thread closed in the first place. You should try discussing the problem with moonkitti in a private chat if possible, I just don't want a repeat of the previous thread. Hope you understand I'm not meaning to sound bossy or anything, just don't want anymore fights to start.
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Post by ❅Maplefrost❅ on Sept 27, 2021 16:48:01 GMT -5
Moonblazer Hey, this is what got the thread closed in the first place. You should try discussing the problem with moonkitti in a private chat if possible, I just don't want a repeat of the previous thread. Hope you understand I'm not meaning to sound bossy or anything, just don't want anymore fights to start. They're pointing out that it wasn't the best type of attention because of the circumstances. But I do agree with you that this should be taken to the DM's now, we don't need more locked threads, so you both have a point. Let's just move on from that now, for OP's sake, and the mods.
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Post by Midnightcacoon loves Sunbeam on Sept 27, 2021 16:48:32 GMT -5
❅Maplefrost❅ Sorry! Thanks for pointing this out
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Post by ❅Maplefrost❅ on Sept 27, 2021 16:49:30 GMT -5
That beings said, I do wonder how the poll will look once all the bots are taken out of the way. But even then it's a bit saddening that it's gotten to this point. The poll looks so pitiful and void of any fun. I personally love both Riverstar and Ivypool, so I do hope they both eventually get SEs, I think that would be nice.
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Post by Midnightcacoon loves Sunbeam on Sept 27, 2021 16:51:40 GMT -5
❅Maplefrost❅ Yes, I'm curious as to what they would write about for ivypool. Could be pretty fun, plus its always nice to see fans enjoying their favorite character. And with riverstar there are endless possibilities they could take
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Post by Moonblazer on Sept 27, 2021 16:52:23 GMT -5
That beings said, I do wonder how the poll will look once all the bots are taken out of the way. But even then it's a bit saddening that it's gotten to this point. The poll looks so pitiful and void of any fun. I personally love both Riverstar and Ivypool, so I do hope they both eventually get SEs, I think that would be nice. I’d love SE’s for both as well. There’s alot they could do with both characters, and maybe we’ll get that eventually.
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Post by ❅Maplefrost❅ on Sept 27, 2021 17:00:38 GMT -5
Personally, my only gripe with Riverstar is the possibility of him being ruined, honestly, that is my biggest fear. His character means a lot to me and others in the fandom, and especially the queer community. The idea of him possibly getting ruined makes my stomach curl with anxiety. I kinda wanna call it the "Curtain Pull" effect. When characters are mysterious and well-liked because of that, but the moment the Erins pull the curtain off they're suddenly "ruined". I've seen it happen to both Raggedstar and Mapleshade over the years which is why I'm even more worried about Riverstar. Like back in the day, before Yellowfang's secret, Ragged was actually well-liked/neutral and pitied, while praised by other characters in canon, and deemed to have a tragic outcome. But that changed with YS, and similar the same happened with Mapleshade. She was well-loved as a new villain and her performance in CP was excellent, but then come to her novella and the mystery part of her character is gone and fans' opinions changed drastically. StarClan is probably the biggest example, their more prominent interference in the recent books have been mostly not liked by fans compared to their mysterious veil back in the first series. Sometimes I think it's better to leave that "veil of mystery" on characters because it's what makes them so mysterious and appealing in the first place. And leaves a lot more room for interpretation and enjoyment, but when you rip that curtain off the narrative reveals things, expectations can be shattered, and fandom opinion changes too. I think Riverstar is a wonderful character, easy top 10 for me, but my fear of him being ruined is like always hovering even if I would love to read an SE on him. I suppose I'm just on the fence about it, it's a great idea, but the execution might be risky, especially because of all the possibilities.
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Post by Chicken on Sept 27, 2021 17:07:37 GMT -5
Try not to worry about it, it's not your fault. I hope you don't feel bad about your thread getting locked, especially when it's not even your fault, my threads would constantly get locked because of drama that other people started, so I know how annoying that can be.
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Post by mintedstar/fur on Sept 27, 2021 17:07:59 GMT -5
//waves// You can take the convo to PMs too, if you want to respond to a new post about a subject that was dropped. Just a tip. ^^
(Edit: Mint's smart reading comp missed the end of Moonblazer's post. Never mind, I'm repeating things other people have said. :') )
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Post by Moonblazer on Sept 27, 2021 17:09:06 GMT -5
I will, Mint. I apologize. I think I’m just still a bit heated. I’ll cool off.
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Post by mintedstar/fur on Sept 27, 2021 17:10:31 GMT -5
NP. I missed the end of your last post.
//claps hands// But on the subject, people brought up some good arguments for a Ivypool SE. Seeing it as a transition piece would be cool. I hope we get both now. I think it would be fun.
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Post by ❅Maplefrost❅ on Sept 27, 2021 17:16:42 GMT -5
Here's what I said about Ivypool getting an SE on another thread: An SE is plenty enough time to get rid of quite a few TPB, TNP and POT characters out of the spotlight finally while pushing for the younger generation to take over. Something I don't think can be covered in just a novella, and something I'd rather them NOT focus on in the next series. Because we'll just have another TBC situation where the narrative is taken away from the new main characters.
It's better to have TC get it's crap together now in an SE over them dragging it into another series and taking away the focus from the new developing characters. Root, Shadow and Bristle are perfect examples and reasons why the first three gens need to be pushed out of the narrative in the main series.
Imo, it doesn't matter how much she's done so far in TBC, it's about where she sits position wise. Ivypool is a character that's perfectly in the middle of the generation gaps, where she's not too old or too young to be deputy and potentially leader. On top of that, because of her previous role as a protagonist she could be used as a narrative gateway for younger characters getting more development and focus down the road.
Her story would have a lot of potential to tell just from the cats connected to her alone. Both her grandparents are old and retired, and have potential death flags. We don't know the status of Birch and White's relationship, especially after the whole Birch being a trainee, and disowned by Dustpelt after Ferncloud's death. They were all affected by Dovewing betraying them and going to ShadowClan. There's also Flipclaw, who is already unsure about where he stands in his life, at such a young age too. Thriftear who has a strained relationship with her sister, and then Bristlefrost who is struggling with her heart and loyalties because of her feelings for Rootspring. Like she has a lot of other potential relationship focus outside of her romance with Fernsong.
In AVoS and TBC, as I already said, Ivypool's voice has weight among her clanmates, and she is well respected. She voiced her word about the clan using vital resources and time to help Twig, she led search patrols to find Dove, she also was one of the few cats the had a significant point about Squirrel's disappearance. And the private moment she had with Bristlefrost, over her choices and what she wanted was notable growth for her character, but also good guidance for Bristlefrost when she needed.
I'd rather Ivypool have a hand in shaping ThunderClan's future in and SE over her possibly suffocating the plot later down the line in the main series like Squirrel/Bramble/Ash are doing now. I honestly do think she and Riverstar do have a lot of potential for good SE's.
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Post by Moonblazer on Sept 27, 2021 17:17:35 GMT -5
Plot twist, they make an SE with all 3 characters and it’s Riverstar being a guide for Mistystar as her mind slowly deteriorates with her age in a similar manner to Bluestar, Ivypool is rising up to be the next Thunderclan leader, and Riverstar recalls flashbacks to his own life as a leader.
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Post by mintedstar/fur on Sept 27, 2021 17:20:28 GMT -5
That is actually a very good argument Maple. o3o That was fun to read!
I feel weird commenting, because I do have investment in the subject. I was excitedly talking about a River SE on the discord. But in this topic I also just popped up out of the blue, so I sound like a mod commenting when I say that. Ahhh whoops.
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Post by Chicken on Sept 27, 2021 17:21:13 GMT -5
Plot twist, they make an SE with all 3 characters and it’s Riverstar being a guide for Mistystar as her mind slowly deteriorates with her age in a similar manner to Bluestar, Ivypool is rising up to be the next Thunderclan leader, and Riverstar recalls flashbacks to his own life as a leader. I LOVE that idea! It would give me hope in this series again.
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Post by ❅Maplefrost❅ on Sept 27, 2021 17:25:43 GMT -5
That is actually a very good argument Maple. o3o That was fun to read! I feel weird commenting, because I do have investment in the subject. I was excitedly talking about a River SE on the discord. But in this topic I also just popped up out of the blue, so I sound like a mod commenting when I say that. Ahhh whoops.Oh Mint no you're fine haha. I love just discussing things like this with anyone really, mod or not lol. It's fun to talk about possibilities for characters and plot.
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Post by Chicken on Sept 27, 2021 17:27:50 GMT -5
That is actually a very good argument Maple. o3o That was fun to read! I feel weird commenting, because I do have investment in the subject. I was excitedly talking about a River SE on the discord. But in this topic I also just popped up out of the blue, so I sound like a mod commenting when I say that. Ahhh whoops.Oh Mint no you're fine haha. I love just discussing things like this with anyone really, mod or not lol. It's fun to talk about possibilities for characters and plot. Agreed! I love seeing different perspectives on things, it really opens up a new window of understanding that I might not have had previously.
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Post by ❅Maplefrost❅ on Sept 27, 2021 17:29:29 GMT -5
Plot twist, they make an SE with all 3 characters and it’s Riverstar being a guide for Mistystar as her mind slowly deteriorates with her age in a similar manner to Bluestar, Ivypool is rising up to be the next Thunderclan leader, and Riverstar recalls flashbacks to his own life as a leader. I LOVE that idea! It would give me hope in this series again. That's actually what I was thinking would happen in River, since Mistystar is on the cover! I thought it would be cool if Riverstar shows up in her dream with a new omen or something and she has go to Mothwing about it. The other idea I liked was Riverstar having involvement with Frostpaw and her upbringing, like a guardian cat.
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Post by Moonblazer on Sept 27, 2021 17:29:47 GMT -5
I love hearing everyone’s excitement on Riverstar though! You don’t need to ever feel bad about feeling excited for such a good character! I do hope he gets one no matter what, seeing as he’s clearly a popular choice even without bots.
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Post by Chicken on Sept 27, 2021 17:31:19 GMT -5
I LOVE that idea! It would give me hope in this series again. That's actually what I was thinking would happen in River, since Mistystar is on the cover! I thought it would be cool if Riverstar shows up in her dream with a new omen or something and she has go to Mothwing about it. The other idea I liked was Riverstar having involvement with Frostpaw and her upbringing, like a guardian cat. That would be really interesting, and I can see it happening since Micah showed up in Pebbleshine's dream or whatever, uhh was it when she was having kits? I don't remember, but I know she showed up, so I can def see Riverstar showing up in Mistystar's being a possibility.
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Post by Pixie on Sept 27, 2021 17:31:32 GMT -5
I voted for Ivypool, but I would not mind a Riverstar SE. If Ivypool gets an SE, I hope there isn't much melodrama about her and Dovewing's relationship. Instead, I would want her to become leader towards the end.
Though, I want Twigbranch to get a super edition because I am heavily biased and I want to see her more even if her character arc has come to a conclusion. But at least with a Ivypool super edition, there is a chance we'll get to see more of my fave since they were close at one point.
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Post by Moonblazer on Sept 27, 2021 17:37:51 GMT -5
Having the OG leaders show up as spirit guides in times of trouble sounds so cool. I wish they utilized that.
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Post by *Faith* on Sept 27, 2021 17:53:14 GMT -5
If Ivypool does win, I just wonder when it will take place. Hopefully not during OOTS for obvious reasons. We never really saw Ivy and Dove's kithood, so I guess it could start there and have a massive timeskip. I also don't think there's going to be much of a timeskip in between TBC and ASC since Flamepaw will (somehow) still be an apprentice.
I honestly have no clue when a Mistystar SE could take place as we know her entire life, she had a novella detailing when she first became leader in FE and she's on the cover of the upcoming River. I guess it could show us her kithood and apprenticeship.
Riverstar's leadership is something we don't really know anything about, as it happened at the beginning of the Clans. Though it might give us a timeline for Shadowstar's Life since we apparently don't know when it takes place. I mean, it starts after TE as Owl Eyes is already deputy, but...
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Post by mintedstar/fur on Sept 27, 2021 18:00:38 GMT -5
Heh, thanks y'all! But yeah, I'm interested to see what happens!
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Post by Katanaheart on Sept 27, 2021 18:34:05 GMT -5
I’m really hoping for a Riverstar SE. I despise having super editions as required reading for the main series and we haven’t had a DOTC cat with SE spotlight since Moth Wing.
Frankly, an Ivypool novella and Riverstar SE sounds like the best combination out of the three. Not to mention my fears of the possibility of Dovewing receiving an SE solely because her sister did. Plus narrative/meta wise, it would be good for both sisters to receive equal amount instead of one getting more, considering their issues with jealousy and the like. But that’s more of an ironic thing I find amusing and I’m sorry if I’m badly explaining that.
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Lesbian
Owl
always writing, never finishing
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Post by Owl on Sept 27, 2021 18:41:05 GMT -5
i'm a big ivypool fan, but i'm uncertain about a super edition for her at the moment. there's a ton of great ideas in this thread on what her SE could center around, and i'd personally love to see more of her and fernsong's relationship, but i can't help but wonder if the erins will be able to fill 400 pages with her modern life. plus, i have a bad feeling we'd get more ivy/dove drama, even if on a small scale, and i really just wish those two would let it go, if they can't make up.
since riverstar's story is essentially a blank slate, the team can basically go wild and do literally whatever they want with it. there's potential for a really unique story with him, if they can come up with something good. plus, any return to the old forest sounds good to me.
i don't have much to say about mistystar. i like her well enough, but she doesn't really seem like the type of character to warrant a novella and a super edition, and i'm assuming they simply picked her because she's going to be a somewhat central character in a starless clan.
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Aroace
#ffa100
Name Colour
𝕱𝖑𝖚𝖙𝖙𝖊𝖗𝖋𝖆𝖑𝖑
Villain Enjoyer
Taking a break from the forums because my cat died. Will probably be back mid to late October.
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Post by 𝕱𝖑𝖚𝖙𝖙𝖊𝖗𝖋𝖆𝖑𝖑 on Sept 28, 2021 4:37:26 GMT -5
As I've said on the original Riverstar SE thread, I voted for Riverstar because he deserves the spotlight and my wish for DotC content is still there. But I'm also not against an Ivypool SE if it has a new storyline for her such as during AVoS and TBC or afterwards with her either remaining as a warrior or rising up as a new deputy/leader.
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