#a3c5e6
Name Colour
𝓣𝓲𝓷𝓾𝓿𝓲𝓮𝓵
Warrior Fanatic
All hail me, the flower-flushing queen of Prague
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Post by 𝓣𝓲𝓷𝓾𝓿𝓲𝓮𝓵 on Apr 5, 2019 22:45:38 GMT -5
Someone from Discord got the book early with the bonus scene. Here's a basic summary from what I was told. The bonus scene is from Jayfeather's PoV, and it takes place before LS. He's been mourning Leafpool, and Alderheart wants to cheer him up, so he arranges for them and the other medicine cats to meet at the Moonpool with hopes that Leafpool will be there. Hollyleaf shows up when they get there, and tells her brother that she and Leafpool have a much stronger bond now and that she's a great mother.
Leafpool shows up afterwards and tells Jayfeather she loves him and how she wishes she could've been a better mother for him. Jayfeather is comforted afterwards, and I guess that's how it ends from what I know. Photos: |
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Post by Pixie on Apr 5, 2019 22:47:54 GMT -5
Thanks for this!
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2019 22:49:20 GMT -5
This is a great closure from the issues they've had in the past. Really pleased with this scene. Love Leafpool and Hollyleaf more than ever now.
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Post by *Faith* on Apr 5, 2019 22:51:20 GMT -5
Thanks! And here is Hollyleaf's first appearance this series. I'm glad she and Leafpool are much closer now. I wonder how Lionblaze reacted when Leafpool died.
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Post by *Ottersplash* on Apr 5, 2019 23:01:59 GMT -5
That makes me SO happy. I'm glad that Leafpool at least gets to be with her kits in StarClan, and that it seems like they accept they essentially have two mothers. It's really sweet.
I'm gonna miss my girl though :c I know a lot of people don't like her, but I just love her gentle nature and how she's willing to help ANYONE in need
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Post by 𝔯𝔞𝔟𝔟𝔦𝔱𝔣𝔯𝔬𝔰𝔱 on Apr 6, 2019 5:10:42 GMT -5
I know Jayfeather is a great medicine cat and all, but I feel like ThunderClan is gonna have a hard time without Leafpool there to soothe Jayfeather’s temper. Because let’s be real, Alderheart just can’t do that like Leafpool can.
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Post by ᏞᎪᎠᎽ Ꮎf fᎪᏁᎠᎾms ミ☆ on Apr 6, 2019 5:20:59 GMT -5
my jayfeather fangirl heart just burst ;-;
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Post by ❅Maplefrost❅ on Apr 6, 2019 13:41:36 GMT -5
Well, this confirms Hollyleaf isn't the voice, now that silly theory can go away.
I like this closure it's very nice. But it also pretty much confirms that Jay is indeed mourning for Leaf, hence that more than usual crabby behavior of his. Poor thing.
Alder did good, he's such a good boy, lol.
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#a3c5e6
Name Colour
𝓣𝓲𝓷𝓾𝓿𝓲𝓮𝓵
Warrior Fanatic
All hail me, the flower-flushing queen of Prague
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Post by 𝓣𝓲𝓷𝓾𝓿𝓲𝓮𝓵 on Apr 6, 2019 13:47:42 GMT -5
Well, this confirms Hollyleaf isn't the voice, now that silly theory can go away. The voice is a tomcat anyway, and when the "theory" about it being Hollyleaf was supposed to be a joke. |
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Post by ❅Maplefrost❅ on Apr 6, 2019 13:51:33 GMT -5
Well, this confirms Hollyleaf isn't the voice, now that silly theory can go away. The voice is a tomcat anyway, and when the "theory" about it being Hollyleaf was supposed to be a joke. Whether it's a joke or not, I think some people were pretty into the idea of it being Holly. Especially considering she used to be obsessed with the code herself and did go off the hinge at one point. But the fact that it's a tom's voice already slashed quite a few possibilities out. |
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#a3c5e6
Name Colour
𝓣𝓲𝓷𝓾𝓿𝓲𝓮𝓵
Warrior Fanatic
All hail me, the flower-flushing queen of Prague
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Post by 𝓣𝓲𝓷𝓾𝓿𝓲𝓮𝓵 on Apr 6, 2019 13:58:37 GMT -5
The voice is a tomcat anyway, and when the "theory" about it being Hollyleaf was supposed to be a joke. Whether it's a joke or not, I think some people were pretty into the idea of it being Holly. Especially considering she used to be obsessed with the code herself and did go off the hinge at one point. But the fact that it's a tom's voice already slashed quite a few possibilities out. That's exactly why I joked that the voice was Hollyleaf, though in reality wouldn't make any sense at all after she returned, even without the voice being revealed to be a tomcat. |
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Post by leafstep on Apr 7, 2019 11:26:10 GMT -5
i love this. the scene in avos where leafpool sees hollyleaf again made me emotional. where hollyleaf told her she was at peace
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Bisexual
#ffc5c5
Official Queen of Fan Clans
Name Colour
ʀᴀɪɴʟᴇᴀғ 🍁
Official ThunderClan & ElmClan Leader
Easing back in
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Post by ʀᴀɪɴʟᴇᴀғ 🍁 on Apr 7, 2019 12:38:43 GMT -5
I can't decide if I like this. Squirrelflight raised the Three and I think the Erins are throwing that away. Then again, how they handle adoptive family is hit or miss. |
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#a3c5e6
Name Colour
𝓣𝓲𝓷𝓾𝓿𝓲𝓮𝓵
Warrior Fanatic
All hail me, the flower-flushing queen of Prague
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Post by 𝓣𝓲𝓷𝓾𝓿𝓲𝓮𝓵 on Apr 7, 2019 13:13:23 GMT -5
I got the book! Goodness, this is the first time I've gotten a physical copy of a Warriors book since MFV. If you guys want me to post some quotes, I can, though it would have to be later.
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#a3c5e6
Name Colour
𝓣𝓲𝓷𝓾𝓿𝓲𝓮𝓵
Warrior Fanatic
All hail me, the flower-flushing queen of Prague
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Post by 𝓣𝓲𝓷𝓾𝓿𝓲𝓮𝓵 on Apr 7, 2019 14:11:14 GMT -5
This is when Hollyleaf talks to Jayfeather: And here's when Leafpool talks to Jayfeather: |
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Post by *Ottersplash* on Apr 7, 2019 14:12:44 GMT -5
I can't decide if I like this. Squirrelflight raised the Three and I think the Erins are throwing that away. Then again, how they handle adoptive family is hit or miss. She raised them, but Leafpool was always involved as well. I don't see why they can't see both of them as mothers? Them loving Leafpool doesn't take away from them loving Squirrelflight, and I'm sure Squirrelflight would encourage the three to love Leafpool. I don't think they're throwing that away. I'm sure when Squirrelflight gets to Starclan, Hollyleaf will welcome her and love on her.. I think it's nice that both the biological parents and adoptive parents love their children so much. Crowfeather wasn't even involved like Leafpool was, but it's clear that he cares greatly for his Thunderclan kits. I like to see it as a big family. |
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Post by *Ottersplash* on Apr 7, 2019 14:15:04 GMT -5
This is when Hollyleaf talks to Jayfeather: And here's when Leafpool talks to Jayfeather: I love that it touches on their trust issues, but also how much they love Leafpool. It's so sweet. My heart hurts. |
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Bisexual
#ffc5c5
Official Queen of Fan Clans
Name Colour
ʀᴀɪɴʟᴇᴀғ 🍁
Official ThunderClan & ElmClan Leader
Easing back in
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Post by ʀᴀɪɴʟᴇᴀғ 🍁 on Apr 7, 2019 14:25:38 GMT -5
I can't decide if I like this. Squirrelflight raised the Three and I think the Erins are throwing that away. Then again, how they handle adoptive family is hit or miss. She raised them, but Leafpool was always involved as well. I don't see why they can't see both of them as mothers? Them loving Leafpool doesn't take away from them loving Squirrelflight, and I'm sure Squirrelflight would encourage the three to love Leafpool. I don't think they're throwing that away. I'm sure when Squirrelflight gets to Starclan, Hollyleaf will welcome her and love on her.. I think it's nice that both the biological parents and adoptive parents love their children so much. Crowfeather wasn't even involved like Leafpool was, but it's clear that he cares greatly for his Thunderclan kits. I like to see it as a big family. The thing is that the Erins are showing Jayfeather still being pathetically petty to Squirrelflight and the Three are leaning towards Leafpool. That's not right. Leafpool gave up her claim and I feel like she's stepping on boundaries that she shouldn't have had in the first place. Why act like a mother if you're going to give them up? That's like a mom giving up her kid and then years later wanting to walk back in their life. No, you gave them up, you have no right to call them a mother. The Erins are throwing away the fact Squirrelflight raised them by doing stuff like this. It's all praise for Leafpool and no mention of what Squirrelflight did. I don't get why people in general complain about the issue of kin being so important and then they support this? How the Erins did Bluestar's relationship with her kits was good. They accepted her as being their biological mother, but they see Graypool as their mother due to her raising them. They should have done it with Leafpool, but I guess the Erin favorite gets a pass. |
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Post by *Ottersplash* on Apr 7, 2019 14:30:57 GMT -5
She raised them, but Leafpool was always involved as well. I don't see why they can't see both of them as mothers? Them loving Leafpool doesn't take away from them loving Squirrelflight, and I'm sure Squirrelflight would encourage the three to love Leafpool. I don't think they're throwing that away. I'm sure when Squirrelflight gets to Starclan, Hollyleaf will welcome her and love on her.. I think it's nice that both the biological parents and adoptive parents love their children so much. Crowfeather wasn't even involved like Leafpool was, but it's clear that he cares greatly for his Thunderclan kits. I like to see it as a big family. The thing is that the Erins are showing Jayfeather still being pathetically petty to Squirrelflight and the Three are leaning towards Leafpool. That's not right. Leafpool gave up her claim and I feel like she's stepping on boundaries that she shouldn't have had in the first place. Why act like a mother if you're going to give them up? That's like a mom giving up her kid and then years later wanting to walk back in their life. No, you gave them up, you have no right to call them a mother. The Erins are throwing away the fact Squirrelflight raised them by doing stuff like this. It's all praise for Leafpool and no mention of what Squirrelflight did. I don't get why people in general complain about the issue of kin being so important and then they support this? How the Erins did Bluestar's relationship with her kits was good. They accepted her as being their biological mother, but they see Graypool as their mother due to her raising them. They should have done it with Leafpool, but I guess the Erin favorite gets a pass. I really think the Jayfeather thing comes more down to him being constantly around Leafpool? She's not just his biological mother, but she's also his mentor and someone he worked closely with for years. On top of that, before he found out about her being his mom, she was still his kin. I really don't see it as throwing away Squirrelflight's sacrifice. I don't see why it has to be either or :/ They both were influential cats in the three's lives. Leafpool only gave them up because she was made to. She would have raised them with Crowfeather if not for Cinderpelt dying (which isn't really selfish. If someone doesn't want to be somewhere anymore, you can't force them). Besides, it's clear Jayfeather and Hollyleaf STILL have reservations in the tidbits we've seen. Leafpool gave them up because it was best for them, and it WAS. Even if Thunderclan had accepted half-clan kits, who is to say that WindClan wouldn't have demanded one or two of the kits because they were part Windclan? In the end, Leafpool is right. Things happened just as they needed to. |
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Bisexual
#ffc5c5
Official Queen of Fan Clans
Name Colour
ʀᴀɪɴʟᴇᴀғ 🍁
Official ThunderClan & ElmClan Leader
Easing back in
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Post by ʀᴀɪɴʟᴇᴀғ 🍁 on Apr 7, 2019 14:40:47 GMT -5
They treat it like it is either or and that's what my aggravation is about. If it was more balanced, and it isn't, then I wouldn't be as mad. It also doesn't help that no matter what, Leafpool gets the up and up in this situation over Squirrelflight. In the end, it's really stupid. They are throwing away Squirrelflight's sacrifice, as it's always about Leafpool and not how great Squirrelflight was to them and what she did for them. Leafpool is selfish and she gets away with it. That's not really a good lesson to teach. She abandoned her Clan for some tom when she could have talked things out with Cinderpelt and Brightheart. In the end, she didn't and it's on them both. I don't get why people are trying to justify Leafpool and then act like Squirrelflight was wrong, instead just throwing the line "she chose to take the Three" and leaving it as that. This is not how you do adoptive family and kin. It's way more one-sided than it should be. I just wish the Three were as harsh on Leafpool as they are on Squirrelflight or softer on Squirrelflight than Leafpool and that is obviously not the case by what we're shown. I'm not changing my mind on this. |
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Post by *Faith* on Apr 7, 2019 15:07:41 GMT -5
This is when Hollyleaf talks to Jayfeather: And here's when Leafpool talks to Jayfeather: Aw! I'm so glad that Hollyleaf and Leafpool have gotten closer. And poor Jayfeather. |
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Post by Brindlefern on Apr 7, 2019 17:48:36 GMT -5
I can't decide if I like this. Squirrelflight raised the Three and I think the Erins are throwing that away. Then again, how they handle adoptive family is hit or miss. She raised them, but Leafpool was always involved as well. I don't see why they can't see both of them as mothers? Them loving Leafpool doesn't take away from them loving Squirrelflight, and I'm sure Squirrelflight would encourage the three to love Leafpool. I don't think they're throwing that away. I'm sure when Squirrelflight gets to Starclan, Hollyleaf will welcome her and love on her.. I think it's nice that both the biological parents and adoptive parents love their children so much. Crowfeather wasn't even involved like Leafpool was, but it's clear that he cares greatly for his Thunderclan kits. I like to see it as a big family. Didn't Fallen Leaves help Hollyleaf appreciate that she had TWO mothers or something btw? I bet when Squirrel dies she'll be welcomed greatly by Hollyleaf too because she's as much as Squirrels' daughter as she is Leafpools'. So the acknowledgement of both Squirrel AND Leaf as her moms was already done long time ago in a novella. I don't mind this now, especially since in the quotes above Leafpool is very thankful for her sister for raising her kits well when she knew she couldn't, despite how rocky it became later. They both love their children equally like mothers, just one is adopted and one biological, but they aren't "throwing away" Squirrelflight being seen as the Three's other mother. It's not "throwing it away" by a long shot, nor is Leafpool "overstepping boundaries" by acting like her mother. She's in Starclan now, no rules stating she can't, so she's perfectly allowed to in the end. |
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Post by alphayamergo on Apr 7, 2019 19:32:38 GMT -5
They treat it like it is either or and that's what my aggravation is about. If it was more balanced, and it isn't, then I wouldn't be as mad. It also doesn't help that no matter what, Leafpool gets the up and up in this situation over Squirrelflight. In the end, it's really stupid. They are throwing away Squirrelflight's sacrifice, as it's always about Leafpool and not how great Squirrelflight was to them and what she did for them. Leafpool is selfish and she gets away with it. That's not really a good lesson to teach. She abandoned her Clan for some tom when she could have talked things out with Cinderpelt and Brightheart. In the end, she didn't and it's on them both. I don't get why people are trying to justify Leafpool and then act like Squirrelflight was wrong, instead just throwing the line "she chose to take the Three" and leaving it as that. This is not how you do adoptive family and kin. It's way more one-sided than it should be. I just wish the Three were as harsh on Leafpool as they are on Squirrelflight or softer on Squirrelflight than Leafpool and that is obviously not the case by what we're shown. I'm not changing my mind on this. With respect, I actually think you are being quite anti-adoption at the moment. Adoption isn't a "sacrifice" for the adoptive parent. Furthermore, the biological parent doesn't magically stop being a parent - especially in Leafpool's case where she was effectively forced to give them up by StarClan. Many adopted children have positive relationships with both their biological and adoptive parents and it's now thought that's much better for the adoptive children in the long run. And while we're at it - finding out you're adopted as an adult is often a very traumatic experience, so the Three being upset is hardly unreasonable. |
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Bisexual
#ffc5c5
Official Queen of Fan Clans
Name Colour
ʀᴀɪɴʟᴇᴀғ 🍁
Official ThunderClan & ElmClan Leader
Easing back in
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Post by ʀᴀɪɴʟᴇᴀғ 🍁 on Apr 8, 2019 7:37:03 GMT -5
They treat it like it is either or and that's what my aggravation is about. If it was more balanced, and it isn't, then I wouldn't be as mad. It also doesn't help that no matter what, Leafpool gets the up and up in this situation over Squirrelflight. In the end, it's really stupid. They are throwing away Squirrelflight's sacrifice, as it's always about Leafpool and not how great Squirrelflight was to them and what she did for them. Leafpool is selfish and she gets away with it. That's not really a good lesson to teach. She abandoned her Clan for some tom when she could have talked things out with Cinderpelt and Brightheart. In the end, she didn't and it's on them both. I don't get why people are trying to justify Leafpool and then act like Squirrelflight was wrong, instead just throwing the line "she chose to take the Three" and leaving it as that. This is not how you do adoptive family and kin. It's way more one-sided than it should be. I just wish the Three were as harsh on Leafpool as they are on Squirrelflight or softer on Squirrelflight than Leafpool and that is obviously not the case by what we're shown. I'm not changing my mind on this. With respect, I actually think you are being quite anti-adoption at the moment. Adoption isn't a "sacrifice" for the adoptive parent. Furthermore, the biological parent doesn't magically stop being a parent - especially in Leafpool's case where she was effectively forced to give them up by StarClan. Many adopted children have positive relationships with both their biological and adoptive parents and it's now thought that's much better for the adoptive children in the long run. And while we're at it - finding out you're adopted as an adult is often a very traumatic experience, so the Three being upset is hardly unreasonable. I'm not being anti-adoption. I only used "sacrifice" to reference to what Otter was saying. I think you're getting it twisted. And actually, the moment you give up your kids on your own will, you aren't a parent. Having kids doesn't automatically make you a parent. Leafpool had several options, she chose to gave them up and she should have respected the boundaries she put in place. We never get any positive scenes with Squirrelflight and that irritates me. She raised them, she is their mother. Leafpool only gave birth to them, she may have mentored Jayfeather but she is not their mother. |
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Post by *Ottersplash* on Apr 8, 2019 12:13:40 GMT -5
With respect, I actually think you are being quite anti-adoption at the moment. Adoption isn't a "sacrifice" for the adoptive parent. Furthermore, the biological parent doesn't magically stop being a parent - especially in Leafpool's case where she was effectively forced to give them up by StarClan. Many adopted children have positive relationships with both their biological and adoptive parents and it's now thought that's much better for the adoptive children in the long run. And while we're at it - finding out you're adopted as an adult is often a very traumatic experience, so the Three being upset is hardly unreasonable. I'm not being anti-adoption. I only used "sacrifice" to reference to what Otter was saying. I think you're getting it twisted. And actually, the moment you give up your kids on your own will, you aren't a parent. Having kids doesn't automatically make you a parent. Leafpool had several options, she chose to gave them up and she should have respected the boundaries she put in place. We never get any positive scenes with Squirrelflight and that irritates me. She raised them, she is their mother. Leafpool only gave birth to them, she may have mentored Jayfeather but she is not their mother. When the secret came out, it pretty much became an open adoption kind of thing, though it always was. Squirrelflight would raise them, but Leafpool would have access. How the three want to view Leafpool is what's important. As she was important to them, they view her as their mother. While Crowfeather isn't viewed as their father. |
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Bisexual
#ffc5c5
Official Queen of Fan Clans
Name Colour
ʀᴀɪɴʟᴇᴀғ 🍁
Official ThunderClan & ElmClan Leader
Easing back in
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Post by ʀᴀɪɴʟᴇᴀғ 🍁 on Apr 8, 2019 12:32:02 GMT -5
But she shouldn't be because she never raised them and that's not right to Squirrelflight. Just because she was outed doesn't make it open adoption. Leafpool just jumped in. I don't know why I keep getting quoted and replied to when I already said I won't change my mind. |
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Post by kells on Apr 8, 2019 14:01:04 GMT -5
Leafpool's reasoning for giving up the kits doesn't make much sense. She lives in ThunderClan, for god's sake, half of the Clan has mixed blood or were kittypets and/or broke the code in some way. They'll welcome anything with open arms, especially with Firestar being leader. You know, Firestar? The cat who disobeyed leader's orders multiple times, fed a ShadowClan cat, covered up his friend's love affair, took in outsiders and left his Clan twice to save another? Second off, if she really needed to lie to prevent any war, embarrassment, tension...etc she could have pulled an Oakheart or Yellowfang. That would have dissolved any confusion, since they'd know about their relationship from the get-go. Absolutely none of the three looked like her, so that would have been easy. She did not have to pressure her sister into that position and with StarClan cats lying to her as well? Absolutely horrible.
Leafpool's general negligence and recklessness is what started this whole mess in the beginning, but even still, despite all this being Leafpool's fault, I can agree Jayfeather and Lionblaze are being ridiculously petty as hell. Move on already, you kits.
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Post by alphayamergo on Apr 8, 2019 18:21:40 GMT -5
Rainleaf doesn't want to debate and tbh neither do I, but since this fandom is generally a pretty young fandom I just want to say it's perfectly fine for adoptees to want to seek out and build a relationship with their birth parents, and it's fine for a birth mother who was pressured or coerced into giving up her children to want to build a relationship with them so long as she respects any and all boundaries the child sets. Lionblaze, Stonefur and Mistystar all clearly prefer their adoptive parents. Jayfeather loves his adoptive parents but is closer to Leafpool because he's spent so much time with her. Hollyleaf wanted nothing to do with her birth mother and later softened her stance. Stormfur and Feathertail adore their birth parents despite the minimal role Graystripe and Silverstream played on their lives. None of these are bad reactions to being adopted and while this series is far from perfect when it comes to handling adoption, I'm glad the series does offer such different outlooks and condemns none of them.
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Post by *Ottersplash* on Apr 8, 2019 18:56:18 GMT -5
Rainleaf doesn't want to debate and tbh neither do I, but since this fandom is generally a pretty young fandom I just want to say it's perfectly fine for adoptees to want to seek out and build a relationship with their birth parents, and it's fine for a birth mother who was pressured or coerced into giving up her children to want to build a relationship with them so long as she respects any and all boundaries the child sets. Lionblaze, Stonefur and Mistystar all clearly prefer their adoptive parents. Jayfeather loves his adoptive parents but is closer to Leafpool because he's spent so much time with her. Hollyleaf wanted nothing to do with her birth mother and later softened her stance. Stormfur and Feathertail adore their birth parents despite the minimal role Graystripe and Silverstream played on their lives. None of these are bad reactions to being adopted and while this series is far from perfect when it comes to handling adoption, I'm glad the series does offer such different outlooks and condemns none of them. I agree. I definitely think Jayfeather softened so much towards Leafpool because of their medicine cat bond. Overall, I like the different types of families in Warriors and I'm super happy to see the 3 also love their biological mom. |
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