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Post by 𝕡𝕖𝕡𝕡𝕖𝕣𝕞𝕚𝕟𝕥 on Sept 7, 2016 6:38:06 GMT -5
Will Needletail and the rest of the ShadowClan traitors go to the Dark Forest when they die, even if they rejoin the Clan?
My answer: possibly.
According to the wiki,
Though this may be somewhat subjective, I believe that most of us can agree that treachery falls under "great crimes". Needletail and the others openly reject the code, claiming that it brings nothing but bloodshed. Even if they decide to atone later down the line, they started a rebellion against their leader, disobeyed him more often than obeying him, and brought their former Clan's security crashing to the ground.
This probably doesn't apply to the cats who stayed behind without supporting the rebellion, since they were pressured into it and scared out of their wits.
This probably doesn't apply to Violetpaw or not. She was forced into the rogue's ranks as a kit, but returned to the Clan. However, we can assume that she engaged in anti-code behavior with full knowledge of the consequences, without much of a choice.
What do you think?
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Post by lollycat on Sept 7, 2016 7:48:26 GMT -5
I believe that what is in the heart is what STARCLAN sees. If the cat is truly sorry for making the mistake than they forgive what has happened. Weren't the live cats that went to the Dark Forest to train forgiven when they repented and came back to the clans and help them defeat the Dark Forest cats? Violetpaw made the choice to leave as soon as she could.
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Post by ✲ριкαƒυєу✲ on Sept 7, 2016 8:30:35 GMT -5
This argument can easily be proven invalid though, if you consider Ashfur. He knew what he was doing, and it was heavily against the code--but yet he went to StarClan.
So, unless Needletail and the others repent and don't openly murder other cats, I don't think they'll be sent to the Dark Forest. If they do, even after repenting, I will be so mad considering Ashfur should've went to the Dark Forest in this case.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 7, 2016 11:44:08 GMT -5
Well... that definition could be true- but realistically, only 20% of the time that applies. Nothing Ashfur did was following the warrior code, yet he still went to StarClan. Antpelt did nothing to break the warrior code. In fact, he wasn't even a bad cat. Yet he strolled in there and didn't look back cause he liked them better than WindClan.
Plus it also depends on whether or not ShadowClan have time to make up for what they did- if they ever get the chance. Those who die in the next few books, without realizing what they did was wrong, will probably go in the dark forest. Those who survive this whole ordeal- and realize what they did was wrong- can possibly try to make up for it and, in the end, do enough good to outweigh the bad by the end of their lives.
But really, nothing is certain- even when the authors pretend things can be. Anyone can go to StarClan, and anyone can go to the Dark Forest. That's really all there is to it- so who knows.
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Post by Uмвяᴀ on Sept 7, 2016 11:45:38 GMT -5
They'll probably be fine as long as they re-prove their loyalties to ShadowClan and learn from their mistake. I don't think they will go to the Dark Forest unless they are truly evil or want to be there.
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Post by kinkajou on Sept 7, 2016 19:04:40 GMT -5
I say they go to the DF
They committed a great crime while rejecting the warrior code, not thinking they were following it
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Post by Bramblestar on Sept 7, 2016 21:12:13 GMT -5
Needletail doesn't deserve a second chance. She's disrespected the code her entire life and knew she was breaking the rules. She enjoyed breaking them in fact.
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Post by Dancing_Totodile on Sept 7, 2016 21:16:58 GMT -5
Needletail doesn't deserve a second chance. She's disrespected the code her entire life and knew she was breaking the rules. She enjoyed breaking them in fact. Agree
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Post by ✲ριкαƒυєу✲ on Sept 7, 2016 23:50:28 GMT -5
Especially after the events in TAS, I want Needletail to go to the DF. She deserves it. Unless she HEAVILY redeems herself, I don't see her EVER deserving to go to StarClan.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 7, 2016 23:59:51 GMT -5
I agree. They all deserve to go to the Dark Forest, but knowing the Erins they probably won't. They're just going to pull another Ashfur and Breezepelt and excuse their actions.
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Post by ❅Maplefrost❅ on Sept 8, 2016 1:38:21 GMT -5
Well I thought it was common knowledge that this point that Ashfur only got into StarClan due to author bias.
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Post by 𝕡𝕖𝕡𝕡𝕖𝕣𝕞𝕚𝕟𝕥 on Sept 8, 2016 5:55:52 GMT -5
Well I thought it was common knowledge that this point that Ashfur only got into StarClan due to author bias. I guess the wiki is trying to justify it...
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Post by frostshade123 on Sept 8, 2016 16:30:02 GMT -5
Needletail doesn't deserve a second chance. She's disrespected the code her entire life and knew she was breaking the rules. She enjoyed breaking them in fact. This.
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