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Post by vectoring34 on Nov 29, 2021 16:12:56 GMT -5
Companion thread to the last, worst mother edition!
Also, bonus points for creativity and picking someone besides Rainflower
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2021 16:17:20 GMT -5
Lizardstripe bc she emotionally abused her children and physically iirc
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Post by Saint Ambrosef on Nov 29, 2021 17:00:34 GMT -5
Smoke intentionally raised her child to be a mass murderer, so. I think she gets Worst Mother of the Year award.
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Post by Midnightcacoon loves Sunbeam on Nov 29, 2021 17:10:01 GMT -5
Sol's mother, her name is cinder I believe. She isn't the worst, but she's defiantly high up there.
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Post by Chicken on Nov 29, 2021 17:37:11 GMT -5
Velvet from SkyClan's Destiny. Words can not express how much this cat angers me.
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Asexual
#07B04C
star_black.png
Name Colour
Ṣanɗypaw™
The Shiny User
🎵Guess that's just the way it goes, easy come, easy go🎵
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Post by Ṣanɗypaw™ on Nov 29, 2021 18:31:03 GMT -5
Lizardstripe for being so horrible to Brokenstar. As much as I dislike him, he didn't deserve that kind of childhood.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2021 18:31:56 GMT -5
I’d probably say bluestar but I want to make it absolutely clear that this isn’t because I dislike bluestar or don’t sympathize with her. she gave up her kits, directly causing the death of mosskit. bluestar did this to save her clan, yes, and it is a tragic situation that brings her much grief, but from the perspective of judging her as a parent, definitely not good.
(I do like bluestar a lot though, she’s a really interesting character.)
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Post by cygna on Nov 29, 2021 18:41:36 GMT -5
Crookedstar's egg donor.
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Post by 𝔯𝔞𝔟𝔟𝔦𝔱𝔣𝔯𝔬𝔰𝔱 on Nov 29, 2021 18:51:10 GMT -5
Rainflower is obviously the top of the list.
But if we're not counting her because she's too obvious, then definitely Lizardstripe or Bluestar. Lizardstripe allowed (and probably actively encouraged, if we're being honest) her kits to bully Brokenkit. She made it clear the entire time she was a queen that she didn't want kits, she was cruel to them, and the only time she ever seemed to show any interest in her kits was when she was preening while the Clan was cooing over them on their first trip out of the nursery.
Bluestar literally gave up her kits so she could become deputy - yes, yes, I know, she did it because she didn't want Thistleclaw to become deputy, but we learn that Sunstar never considered Thistleclaw at all, so it was all for nothing, and it had horrible consequences for her kits. Mosskit's death is the most obvious, but Stonefur's death is also indirectly caused by Bluestar giving him and Mistyfoot up to RiverClan. If Stonefur hadn't been a RiverClan cat, he never would've been part of TigerClan, never would've become Tigerstar's prisoner, and never would've been killed.
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Post by whiteflight on Nov 29, 2021 21:31:11 GMT -5
Rainflower is obviously the top of the list. But if we're not counting her because she's too obvious, then definitely Lizardstripe or Bluestar. Lizardstripe allowed (and probably actively encouraged, if we're being honest) her kits to bully Brokenkit. She made it clear the entire time she was a queen that she didn't want kits, she was cruel to them, and the only time she ever seemed to show any interest in her kits was when she was preening while the Clan was cooing over them on their first trip out of the nursery. Bluestar literally gave up her kits so she could become deputy - yes, yes, I know, she did it because she didn't want Thistleclaw to become deputy, but we learn that Sunstar never considered Thistleclaw at all, so it was all for nothing, and it had horrible consequences for her kits. Mosskit's death is the most obvious, but Stonefur's death is also indirectly caused by Bluestar giving him and Mistyfoot up to RiverClan. If Stonefur hadn't been a RiverClan cat, he never would've been part of TigerClan, never would've become Tigerstar's prisoner, and never would've been killed. I don't really think Stonefur's death was Bluestar's fault. The only people who knew about the truth was Bluestar, Fireheart, Stonefur, Mistyfoot and later down the road Tigerstar. Riverclan didn't know about it until Stonefur decided to tell the whole clan. If he didn't tell them I'm sure Leopardstar and everyone else in Riverclan would have got into an argument with Tigerstar when he tried to put those two in "cat prison".
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2021 22:20:27 GMT -5
Rainflower is obviously the top of the list. But if we're not counting her because she's too obvious, then definitely Lizardstripe or Bluestar. Lizardstripe allowed (and probably actively encouraged, if we're being honest) her kits to bully Brokenkit. She made it clear the entire time she was a queen that she didn't want kits, she was cruel to them, and the only time she ever seemed to show any interest in her kits was when she was preening while the Clan was cooing over them on their first trip out of the nursery. Bluestar literally gave up her kits so she could become deputy - yes, yes, I know, she did it because she didn't want Thistleclaw to become deputy, but we learn that Sunstar never considered Thistleclaw at all, so it was all for nothing, and it had horrible consequences for her kits. Mosskit's death is the most obvious, but Stonefur's death is also indirectly caused by Bluestar giving him and Mistyfoot up to RiverClan. If Stonefur hadn't been a RiverClan cat, he never would've been part of TigerClan, never would've become Tigerstar's prisoner, and never would've been killed. wait I don’t remember the thing about sunstar never considering thistleclaw?
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Post by kells on Nov 29, 2021 22:47:57 GMT -5
Lizardstripe. While Rainflower only mentally abused Crookedstar, Lizardstripe did both. Physically and mentally abusing Brokenstar
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Post by ❅Maplefrost❅ on Nov 29, 2021 23:58:10 GMT -5
Lizardstripe, Rainflower, and Squirrelflight.
Edit: How could I forget the likes of Moonlight, good god.
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Post by ᏞᎪᎠᎽ Ꮎf fᎪᏁᎠᎾms ミ☆ on Nov 30, 2021 0:49:00 GMT -5
Aside from the obvious choices that were created to be hated, or meant to be an antagonist. Squirrelflight is the worse mother imo. As she’s not only made poor parenting choices raising not just 1, but 2 litter’s of kits. Her bad parenting with the Three is self-explanatory, her lying to them had devastating, long-lasting effects that will probably never completely heal. The lies drove Hollyleaf to madness to where she couldn’t live with the truth to put it mildly. And then even after having several years to reflect on the horrendous choices she’s made in the past, she continues to make bad decisions with her 2nd litter . Most notably having sparkpelt keeping secrets and lying to her own father, but even outside that she’s not particularly very involved or shown offering good motherly advice when her children are having troubles(except SqH) Especially Alderheart, heck Leafpool was probably a more supportive motherly figure then his own mother. And too think she wanted to raise a 3rd litter, which I’m not exactly gonna hold against her for merely wishing to have more children(which we really do not need) but Squirrelflight certainly needs to reevaluate her parental methods before even considering rearing more kits . squirrelflight also didn't spend much time in the nursery for lion,holly, and jay...like yeah sure, she couldnt actually do much because she physically couldnt nurse them, but she still left them behind with ferncloud, preferring to do her warrior duties over being with the kits that were supposed to be hers lol. ferncloud was more of a mother to the three when they were kits than squirrelflight. squirrelflight as a mother when they were 'paws and young full named clan cats is another thing. and just because jayfeather spent the most time with leafpool, she felt more motherly in their scenes together too.
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Cloudstorm
Don’t let it kill you. Even when it hurts like hell.
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Post by Cloudstorm on Nov 30, 2021 1:13:31 GMT -5
Lizardstripe, Rainflower, and Squirrelflight. Edit: How could I forget the likes of Moonlight, good god. I’ve tried to erase SqH entire existence from my brain lol, and the Sisters .
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Cloudstorm
Don’t let it kill you. Even when it hurts like hell.
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Post by Cloudstorm on Nov 30, 2021 1:23:48 GMT -5
Aside from the obvious choices that were created to be hated, or meant to be an antagonist. Squirrelflight is the worse mother imo. As she’s not only made poor parenting choices raising not just 1, but 2 litter’s of kits. Her bad parenting with the Three is self-explanatory, her lying to them had devastating, long-lasting effects that will probably never completely heal. The lies drove Hollyleaf to madness to where she couldn’t live with the truth to put it mildly. And then even after having several years to reflect on the horrendous choices she’s made in the past, she continues to make bad decisions with her 2nd litter . Most notably having sparkpelt keeping secrets and lying to her own father, but even outside that she’s not particularly very involved or shown offering good motherly advice when her children are having troubles(except SqH) Especially Alderheart, heck Leafpool was probably a more supportive motherly figure then his own mother. And too think she wanted to raise a 3rd litter, which I’m not exactly gonna hold against her for merely wishing to have more children(which we really do not need) but Squirrelflight certainly needs to reevaluate her parental methods before even considering rearing more kits . squirrelflight also didn't spend much time in the nursery for lion,holly, and jay...like yeah sure, she couldnt actually do much because she physically couldnt nurse them, but she still left them behind with ferncloud, preferring to do her warrior duties over being with the kits that were supposed to be hers lol. ferncloud was more of a mother to the three when they were kits than squirrelflight. squirrelflight as a mother when they were 'paws and young full named clan cats is another thing. and just because jayfeather spent the most time with leafpool, she felt more motherly in their scenes together too. ohhh I could probably write an entire essay on how I think Squirrelflight is a terrible mother…..ummmmmm maybe another time. But the fact she was very undeservingly given a second chance to be a better mother, and didn’t really improve or learn from her mistakes from the last time, and given the fact she’s supposed to be this passionate cat that feels and loves deeply according to the Editing/writing team, and maintains a strong bond with her sister, and that her “good intentions” are now protected by extremely biased narrative that twists her bad decisions into the right choices for some reason. Rubs salt onto the wounds that she’s still a mediocre, only covers the bare minimum requirements expected from a parent, Type mother. There's worse in the series, but they were created for that very purpose to be hated, and the narrative acknowledges it.
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Post by ᏞᎪᎠᎽ Ꮎf fᎪᏁᎠᎾms ミ☆ on Nov 30, 2021 1:57:48 GMT -5
squirrelflight also didn't spend much time in the nursery for lion,holly, and jay...like yeah sure, she couldnt actually do much because she physically couldnt nurse them, but she still left them behind with ferncloud, preferring to do her warrior duties over being with the kits that were supposed to be hers lol. ferncloud was more of a mother to the three when they were kits than squirrelflight. squirrelflight as a mother when they were 'paws and young full named clan cats is another thing. and just because jayfeather spent the most time with leafpool, she felt more motherly in their scenes together too. ohhh I could probably write an entire essay on how I think Squirrelflight is a terrible mother….. ummmmmm maybe another time. But the fact she was very undeservingly given a second chance to be a better mother, and didn’t really improve or learn from her mistakes from the last time, and given the fact she’s supposed to be this passionate cat that feels and loves deeply according to the Editing/writing team, and maintains a strong bond with her sister, and that her “good intentions” are now protected by extremely biased narrative that twists her bad decisions into the right choices for some reason . Rubs salt onto the wounds that she’s still a mediocre, only covers the bare minimum requirements expected from a parent, Type mother. Their’s worse in the series, but they were created for that very purpose to be hated, and the narrative acknowledges it. ngl, i'd be interested in reading that essay. i never really thought about squirrelflight's parenting. i tend to focus on the other parts of her character that make her bad
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Post by Aqua on Nov 30, 2021 5:48:57 GMT -5
Leafpool. This says a lot because it hurts me, she's my favorite, but she abandoned her kits she shouldn't have had in the first place, and because of that action alone she made Squirrelflight lie to her clan and indirectly mentally affected Hollyleaf. Hollyleaf wanted cats dead because she was so hurt. Jayfeather still holds this against Squirrelflight and Leafpool to this day. The three were mad at both of them for lying to them, and Leafpool couldn't summon the courage to even tell them about Crowfeather being the father; they had to figure it out for themselves.
Because of this reason alone, Leafpool is an awful mother who abandoned her kits and they had a right to hate her for a long time for it. I love her, but dragging other cats into the problems that she created in the first place (if I remember correctly, she only ran off because she felt Brightheart was replacing her; this problem could've easily been solved if she and Cinderpelt just talked it out and told her Brightheart's situation was temporary) asking her sister to lie to her clan and pretend she's their mother, was just wrong. At least Bluestar had a reason to abandon her kits. If Leafpool just told Firestar, she would have been fine. He wasn't going exile his own daughter.
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Post by Twilight Sparkle on Nov 30, 2021 8:04:43 GMT -5
Quiet Rain had some bad moments as a mother. All and all, she wasn't too bad, but I certainly didn't like her.
I also don't like Millie as a mother. She isn't the worse, but I'm listing cats who weren't already mentioned.
Palebird started out okay, but after she had her second litter, she was a terrible mother to Tallstar.
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Post by Saint Ambrosef on Nov 30, 2021 9:36:22 GMT -5
@citrus 𝔯𝔞𝔟𝔟𝔦𝔱𝔣𝔯𝔬𝔰𝔱 Wasn't another big reason Bluestar gave Oakheart their kits because ThunderClan was slowly starving to death that Leaf-Bare (so much so that she had no milk), and she knew they'd be well-fed in RiverClan?
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Post by Saint Ambrosef on Nov 30, 2021 9:39:38 GMT -5
Leafpool. This says a lot because it hurts me, she's my favorite, but she abandoned her kits she shouldn't have had in the first place, and because of that action alone she made Squirrelflight lie to her clan and indirectly mentally affected Hollyleaf. Hollyleaf wanted cats dead because she was so hurt. Jayfeather still holds this against Squirrelflight and Leafpool to this day. The three were mad at both of them for lying to them, and Leafpool couldn't summon the courage to even tell them about Crowfeather being the father; they had to figure it out for themselves. Because of this reason alone, Leafpool is an awful mother who abandoned her kits and they had a right to hate her for a long time for it. I love her, but dragging other cats into the problems that she created in the first place (if I remember correctly, she only ran off because she felt Brightheart was replacing her; this problem could've easily been solved if she and Cinderpelt just talked it out and told her Brightheart's situation was temporary) asking her sister to lie to her clan and pretend she's their mother, was just wrong. At least Bluestar had a reason to abandon her kits. If Leafpool just told Firestar, she would have been fine. He wasn't going exile his own daughter. I think it might be a little more complicated than that. Not saying Leafpool was in the right, per se, but I think she was a lot more worried about her kits growing up to be the Clan pariahs than she was about potential exile. Her motivation at least in part seemed to be wanting her children to grow up with normal, un-stigmatized lives.
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#a3c5e6
Name Colour
𝓣𝓲𝓷𝓾𝓿𝓲𝓮𝓵
Warrior Fanatic
All hail me, the flower-flushing queen of Prague
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Post by 𝓣𝓲𝓷𝓾𝓿𝓲𝓮𝓵 on Nov 30, 2021 9:40:27 GMT -5
Besides Rainflower? Lizardstripe.
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#a3c5e6
Name Colour
𝓣𝓲𝓷𝓾𝓿𝓲𝓮𝓵
Warrior Fanatic
All hail me, the flower-flushing queen of Prague
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Post by 𝓣𝓲𝓷𝓾𝓿𝓲𝓮𝓵 on Nov 30, 2021 9:50:22 GMT -5
@citrus 𝔯𝔞𝔟𝔟𝔦𝔱𝔣𝔯𝔬𝔰𝔱 Wasn't another big reason Bluestar gave Oakheart their kits because ThunderClan was slowly starving to death that Leaf-Bare (so much so that she had no milk), and she knew they'd be well-fed in RiverClan? She did. Hardly anyone ever brings this up. Just because Thistleclaw happened to be her primary reason for giving up her kits doesn't mean it was the only one. Whether or not she should've taken them out in a blizzard is another story, but her motivation wasn't an entirely selfish one, either.
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Post by Aqua on Nov 30, 2021 10:26:50 GMT -5
Leafpool. This says a lot because it hurts me, she's my favorite, but she abandoned her kits she shouldn't have had in the first place, and because of that action alone she made Squirrelflight lie to her clan and indirectly mentally affected Hollyleaf. Hollyleaf wanted cats dead because she was so hurt. Jayfeather still holds this against Squirrelflight and Leafpool to this day. The three were mad at both of them for lying to them, and Leafpool couldn't summon the courage to even tell them about Crowfeather being the father; they had to figure it out for themselves. Because of this reason alone, Leafpool is an awful mother who abandoned her kits and they had a right to hate her for a long time for it. I love her, but dragging other cats into the problems that she created in the first place (if I remember correctly, she only ran off because she felt Brightheart was replacing her; this problem could've easily been solved if she and Cinderpelt just talked it out and told her Brightheart's situation was temporary) asking her sister to lie to her clan and pretend she's their mother, was just wrong. At least Bluestar had a reason to abandon her kits. If Leafpool just told Firestar, she would have been fine. He wasn't going exile his own daughter. I think it might be a little more complicated than that. Not saying Leafpool was in the right, per se, but I think she was a lot more worried about her kits growing up to be the Clan pariahs than she was about potential exile. Her motivation at least in part seemed to be wanting her children to grow up with normal, un-stigmatized lives. I know why she had to keep her kits a secret, and I know that StarClan also begged her and Squirrelflight to keep them a secret. But she shouldn't have ran off in the first place, and because of that she messed up and ruined everything for herself. This is coming from someone who loves Leafpool.
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Post by vectoring34 on Nov 30, 2021 10:52:09 GMT -5
@citrus 𝔯𝔞𝔟𝔟𝔦𝔱𝔣𝔯𝔬𝔰𝔱 Wasn't another big reason Bluestar gave Oakheart their kits because ThunderClan was slowly starving to death that Leaf-Bare (so much so that she had no milk), and she knew they'd be well-fed in RiverClan? Bluestar never once mentions this as a reason or even thinks it. One is free to infer it since it is noted that Thunderclan was having food troubles, but in all of her internal monologues, it's purely about the fact that she's doing this for the clan and to "burn" with zero mention of food issues. Hardly a big reason. I'm not convinced the food problem was that bad either. Even Tawnyspots who was horribly sick and dying, managed to survive through the winter fine enough that he was able to stand and attend Bluedur's deputyship ceremony. It was a rough winter but the kits would have been fine so long as they weren't strained too much.
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Post by Hollyfall on Nov 30, 2021 11:12:33 GMT -5
Moonlight
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Post by 𝐛𝐥𝟒𝐜𝐤𝐬𝐨𝐥 on Nov 30, 2021 16:55:41 GMT -5
Besides Rainflower, Lizardstripe is a very obvious choice. Palebird was just horrible towards Tallstar, and Cinder was also bad.
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Post by rabbit on Nov 30, 2021 20:12:29 GMT -5
I feel like Moth Flight should get a mention here. I don’t remember the SE very well, but she basically gave up her kits and separated them all to different clans? Then she makes the dumb rule where all medicine cats can’t take a mate or have kits because she couldn’t handle it.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 30, 2021 20:24:34 GMT -5
I feel like Moth Flight should get a mention here. I don’t remember the SE very well, but she basically gave up her kits and separated them all to different clans? Then she makes the dumb rule where all medicine cats can’t take a mate or have kits because she couldn’t handle it. oh yeah! yeah moth flight sucks. splitting up her children between the clans is super irresponsible and honestly kind of cruel. and windstar wasn’t too good of a mom either
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