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Post by Leapkit on Oct 15, 2021 20:29:29 GMT -5
I just really wanted to hear peoples opinions on this. It seems like a really polarizing topic among gamers and non gamers alike.
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Post by Gold on Oct 15, 2021 23:35:46 GMT -5
As a gamer myself, it’s one of the very few points posed by moral guardians that I actually agree with.
In a system where it’s possible to put money into the game and use that money to buy a loot box — the CHANCE to win something — it is essentially the same as gambling, activates those same pleasure centers that gambling triggers, all that jazz.
The biggest reason I can suggest why its polarizing is because a game that features gambling is slapped with an Adults Only rating, as a clear indicator to signal that “this game can empty your actual bank account if you’re not careful, don’t let it get into the hands of your children and gambling addicts.” The AO rating also effectively caps a game’s sales, because most networks and stores won’t carry or advertise such a game. So game publishers and developers that abuse loot box mechanics like this go to extra lengths to obfuscate these mechanics to keep a friendlier rating, which is where you’re going to hear terms like “just like kinder eggs” and “surprise mechanics”.
The end result is that people at risk of being harmed by gambling are now more likely to be exposed to it. There are stories abound about how people with poor self-control bankrupted themselves, and how children have accidentally emptied bank accounts, so I have no doubt that it is a harmful practice.
A tertiary point is also that it just ruins my favorite industry. A quick search on YouTube can quickly turn up presentations and seminars given by greedy POS’s about how to make a game deliberately un-fun and imbalanced against someone who doesn’t make microtransaction purchases in order to push them into spending money, with the intention of “hooking whales”, or the players that will spend exorbitant amounts of money (who also tend to be children or gambling addicts).
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Post by ᏞᎪᎠᎽ Ꮎf fᎪᏁᎠᎾms ミ☆ on Oct 16, 2021 0:08:51 GMT -5
those things r chance type things, right? then yeah, i'd say it's gambling. i know about stuff like CS:GO where people buy boxes and then open it to see which level weapon they get (i remember reds and purples were the rare/expensive ones they always wanted to get).
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Post by Numquam on Oct 16, 2021 8:31:08 GMT -5
I play a lot of gacha games and yes it absolutely is. You're betting your in-game currency for a chance of getting a character/item you want, and there's the risk that you won't get what you want. It gets even worse that these games have the option of paying real irl money so you can get more in-game currency in order to pull more.
I do a good job at not spending real money on these games, but it's unfortunately easy to see how someone can be tempted in doing so. The chances of getting an SSR character tends to be 1% or less (it depends on the game but it's always a very low percentage). Most of the time, you're not going to get your SSR character in one 10-pull, it's all a game of chance, so you can't really predict when you'll get your character. You end up getting other characters you don't want or already have, but you tell yourself "Oh maybe this time I'll get it! Just one more." and so you keep pulling. Some games will give you a guarantee SSR (not necessarily the one you want) if you pull a certain number of times, but that number is often pretty high and thus uses a large amount of your in-game currency anyway.
In-game currency isn't really given out like candy in these games. Getting the in-game currency is a gradual process that encourages you to play everyday, because you can get a little bit everyday. It's not easy to acquire, but it's very easy to use up all of it when you don't get the character you want. If you use up all your in-game currency, you might not make enough by the time the character's banner ends. It's very easy to use up all of your currency and still not get the character you want, thus tempting you to use real money because that way, you can just buy the in-game currency immediately. In a lot of gacha games, a 10-pull usually costs around $30 USD. In some games, if it's your first time using real money to buy the in-game currency, it'll double the amount of currency you get for just your first time, further tempting you on buying it with your real money. These games will also have monthly or weekly packs you can buy with real money that give you a small amount of items and in-game currency from time to time.
A lot of gacha games make it so that their SSR characters are better and easier to use compared to the lower-rarity characters. You want to get the super rare characters, because they're made to enhance your gaming experience. A very common mistake that people make when getting into these games is that they only want to use the SSR characters and don't want to bother with the lower-rarity/easy-to-get characters. A lot of gacha games will make their lower-rarity characters still useable and fun to use, but not all of them do. People new to the genre will fall into that trap they must only use the hard-to-get characters, and thus making it more tempting to spend money so they can get those characters.
Gacha games are made to be predatory because they know it's easy money.
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Post by Leapkit on Oct 16, 2021 9:50:19 GMT -5
I play a lot of gacha games and yes it absolutely is. You're betting your in-game currency for a chance of getting a character/item you want, and there's the risk that you won't get what you want. It gets even worse that these games have the option of paying real irl money so you can get more in-game currency in order to pull more. I do a good job at not spending real money on these games, but it's unfortunately easy to see how someone can be tempted in doing so. The chances of getting an SSR character tends to be 1% or less (it depends on the game but it's always a very low percentage). Most of the time, you're not going to get your SSR character in one 10-pull, it's all a game of chance, so you can't really predict when you'll get your character. You end up getting other characters you don't want or already have, but you tell yourself "Oh maybe this time I'll get it! Just one more." and so you keep pulling. Some games will give you a guarantee SSR (not necessarily the one you want) if you pull a certain number of times, but that number is often pretty high and thus uses a large amount of your in-game currency anyway. In-game currency isn't really given out like candy in these games. Getting the in-game currency is a gradual process that encourages you to play everyday, because you can get a little bit everyday. It's not easy to acquire, but it's very easy to use up all of it when you don't get the character you want. If you use up all your in-game currency, you might not make enough by the time the character's banner ends. It's very easy to use up all of your currency and still not get the character you want, thus tempting you to use real money because that way, you can just buy the in-game currency immediately. In a lot of gacha games, a 10-pull usually costs around $30 USD. In some games, if it's your first time using real money to buy the in-game currency, it'll double the amount of currency you get for just your first time, further tempting you on buying it with your real money. These games will also have monthly or weekly packs you can buy with real money that give you a small amount of items and in-game currency from time to time. A lot of gacha games make it so that their SSR characters are better and easier to use compared to the lower-rarity characters. You want to get the super rare characters, because they're made to enhance your gaming experience. A very common mistake that people make when getting into these games is that they only want to use the SSR characters and don't want to bother with the lower-rarity/easy-to-get characters. A lot of gacha games will make their lower-rarity characters still useable and fun to use, but not all of them do. People new to the genre will fall into that trap they must only use the hard-to-get characters, and thus making it more tempting to spend money so they can get those characters. Gacha games are made to be predatory because they know it's easy money. Im wondering what kinda game youre playing that costs $30 for a 10 pull, when I've seen the games theyre usually also $10 or less. Mostly because the average person is way more likely to say "yeah i can afford $10 every now and then" and then other/extra pulls or premium currencies come in bundles and such to seem enticing to spend more. but its the small charges that rack up fast.
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Post by 𝚜𝚙𝚊𝚛𝚔𝚜𝚌𝚊𝚝𝚝𝚎𝚛 on Oct 16, 2021 10:39:13 GMT -5
yeah
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Post by Numquam on Oct 16, 2021 15:00:12 GMT -5
I play a lot of gacha games and yes it absolutely is. You're betting your in-game currency for a chance of getting a character/item you want, and there's the risk that you won't get what you want. It gets even worse that these games have the option of paying real irl money so you can get more in-game currency in order to pull more. I do a good job at not spending real money on these games, but it's unfortunately easy to see how someone can be tempted in doing so. The chances of getting an SSR character tends to be 1% or less (it depends on the game but it's always a very low percentage). Most of the time, you're not going to get your SSR character in one 10-pull, it's all a game of chance, so you can't really predict when you'll get your character. You end up getting other characters you don't want or already have, but you tell yourself "Oh maybe this time I'll get it! Just one more." and so you keep pulling. Some games will give you a guarantee SSR (not necessarily the one you want) if you pull a certain number of times, but that number is often pretty high and thus uses a large amount of your in-game currency anyway. In-game currency isn't really given out like candy in these games. Getting the in-game currency is a gradual process that encourages you to play everyday, because you can get a little bit everyday. It's not easy to acquire, but it's very easy to use up all of it when you don't get the character you want. If you use up all your in-game currency, you might not make enough by the time the character's banner ends. It's very easy to use up all of your currency and still not get the character you want, thus tempting you to use real money because that way, you can just buy the in-game currency immediately. In a lot of gacha games, a 10-pull usually costs around $30 USD. In some games, if it's your first time using real money to buy the in-game currency, it'll double the amount of currency you get for just your first time, further tempting you on buying it with your real money. These games will also have monthly or weekly packs you can buy with real money that give you a small amount of items and in-game currency from time to time. A lot of gacha games make it so that their SSR characters are better and easier to use compared to the lower-rarity characters. You want to get the super rare characters, because they're made to enhance your gaming experience. A very common mistake that people make when getting into these games is that they only want to use the SSR characters and don't want to bother with the lower-rarity/easy-to-get characters. A lot of gacha games will make their lower-rarity characters still useable and fun to use, but not all of them do. People new to the genre will fall into that trap they must only use the hard-to-get characters, and thus making it more tempting to spend money so they can get those characters. Gacha games are made to be predatory because they know it's easy money. Im wondering what kinda game youre playing that costs $30 for a 10 pull, when I've seen the games theyre usually also $10 or less. Mostly because the average person is way more likely to say "yeah i can afford $10 every now and then" and then other/extra pulls or premium currencies come in bundles and such to seem enticing to spend more. but its the small charges that rack up fast. Fate GO, Arknights, Punishing Grey Raven, and Granblue Fantasy - some are closer to $25 or $27. I believe Genshin Impact is closer to $20.
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Post by Fireleap on Oct 16, 2021 20:36:28 GMT -5
I know nothing about gacha games, but loot boxes are absolutely gambling.
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Post by Leapkit on Oct 18, 2021 13:52:17 GMT -5
Im wondering what kinda game youre playing that costs $30 for a 10 pull, when I've seen the games theyre usually also $10 or less. Mostly because the average person is way more likely to say "yeah i can afford $10 every now and then" and then other/extra pulls or premium currencies come in bundles and such to seem enticing to spend more. but its the small charges that rack up fast. Fate GO, Arknights, Punishing Grey Raven, and Granblue Fantasy - some are closer to $25 or $27. I believe Genshin Impact is closer to $20. Yikes. I think I would probably just quit playing.
The only games I've ever played with a gacha-esque mechanic that I liked were Unison League and Questland- both offer gobs of premium currency for watching videos or hitting certain achievements so if I sit down and play them for a few hours I can get a 10 pull of the more expensive spins by the end of the day- or by the end of the week if i just play a little bit. The rates still arent the best for the really good stuff but it's free so it's decent.
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Post by Saint Ambrosef on Oct 18, 2021 15:28:42 GMT -5
Yes.
I would not consider it gambling if it was in-game currency and potentially limited in use. For instance, if you could only pull once a day. Alternatively, if the “gambling” is based in a mini-game so that skill determines your outcome, like in card games, rather than pure luck. And then the actual game involved is entertainment itself, rather than mindlessly forking over money to pay-to-win.
Gambling to me is any time you put up money for the very slim, uncontrollable chance that you may get something of value back. No different that the lottery or slot machine.
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