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Onestar
Nov 13, 2019 10:35:24 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Nov 13, 2019 10:35:24 GMT -5
Okay, I said that Onestar was a psychopath before, and I was wrong. There are MUCH better ways to describe him. Cruel, heartless, cowardly, traitor, self-serving, infuriating, weak-willed.
Anyway, he wanted to trap stoats, stoats that he believed who killed one of his warriors onto ThunderClan territory.
He turned his back on the guy who saved his life three times, the guy who even gave up one of his lives for him, the guy who helped him become leader in the first place, and insulted him at every turn.
Then, when Bramblestar offers to help him, instead of being courteous and thanking him, he insults him and accuses him of killing Firestar to become leader.
He also insults him because he's "young and inexperienced"
Too bad he can't get a lesson from his cousin Tornear on how to be respectful towards new leaders. Though, I suppose he is a higher rank than Tornear was, and he and Bramblestar on equal footing, but still.
Not only did he do those rat-worthy things, but he also attacked ThunderClan's camp in the dead of the night, involving kits and elders into the fight.
Also, when Darktail came to town, instead of facing up to the fact that he abandoned his son and his mate, he ordered his warriors to stop fighting, which resulted in RiverClan getting totally messed over I think.
And there's the thing with him refusing to give the herb to ShadowClan, which resulted in the deaths of Wasptail, Kinkfur, and Crowfrost.
And that's all I really have to say I guess.
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Post by *Faith* on Nov 13, 2019 17:35:19 GMT -5
Yeah, CT showed him as not the best leader for WC. Harestar seems to be doing much better, which is ironic considering his characterization in POT. Harestar clearly grew up since then.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 13, 2019 17:42:44 GMT -5
Yeah, CT showed him as not the best leader for WC. Harestar seems to be doing much better, which is ironic considering his characterization in POT. Harestar clearly grew up since then. I agree I loved how in CT, Harespring is talking about how he can't go against Onestar, and then, in A Vision of Shadows, he went against Onestar, so maybe during the events of CT, he had character growth, and stopped being a blind follower to Onestar, that was afraid of stepping over any lines. I love Harestar
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Onestar
Nov 13, 2019 18:56:12 GMT -5
Post by Fernshiine on Nov 13, 2019 18:56:12 GMT -5
Onestar...he drives me insane. I think he was a bit of a psychopath. He tossed Firestar aside like nothing, as well as Smoke and Darktail. He's...not a good cat...
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Onestar
Nov 13, 2019 19:06:54 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Nov 13, 2019 19:06:54 GMT -5
Onestar...he drives me insane. I think he was a bit of a psychopath. He tossed Firestar aside like nothing, as well as Smoke and Darktail. He's...not a good cat... Yeah! That ticked me off to no end what he did to Firestar, like Firestar saved his life three times, he literally gave up one of his lives for him, and he helped him get leadership in the first place. I love how Lionblaze called him out on that, he was like, "You were perfectly happy to have ThunderClan meddle when Mudclaw was trying to drive you out." or something like that. I also don't like how he was getting on Bramblestar's case just because he's a "new and inexperienced" leader, what he said to him was way out of line.
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Post by vectoring34 on Nov 14, 2019 16:30:28 GMT -5
He's not even remotely psychopathic. Onestar panicked and freaked out when Darktail told him he was his son. A psychopath would have just gone "kay" and then ripped out his throat. Onestar is just a plain case of overcompensating hard for lack of validation and self-confidence with reckless stunts, nothing pathological there.
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Onestar
Nov 14, 2019 16:38:20 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Nov 14, 2019 16:38:20 GMT -5
He's not even remotely psychopathic. Onestar panicked and freaked out when Darktail told him he was his son. A psychopath would have just gone "kay" and then ripped out his throat. Onestar is just a plain case of overcompensating hard for lack of validation and self-confidence with reckless stunts, nothing pathological there. What about him wanting to bring the stoats onto ThunderClan territory? He even said that he was "leaving a gift" for them. Also, what about him telling his warriors to attack ThunderClan in their camp while they were asleep? To attack kits and elders? Also, the deaths of Wasptail, Crowfrost, and Kinkfur are on his paws, because he straight up REFUSED to give herbs to ShadowClan that could have saved them. He was putting EVERY ShadowClan cat in danger. He's a selfish ungrateful rat.
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Post by vectoring34 on Nov 14, 2019 16:44:50 GMT -5
He's not even remotely psychopathic. Onestar panicked and freaked out when Darktail told him he was his son. A psychopath would have just gone "kay" and then ripped out his throat. Onestar is just a plain case of overcompensating hard for lack of validation and self-confidence with reckless stunts, nothing pathological there. What about him wanting to bring the stoats onto ThunderClan territory? He even said that he was "leaving a gift" for them. Also, what about him telling his warriors to attack ThunderClan in their camp while they were asleep? To attack kits and elders? Also, the deaths of Wasptail, Crowfrost, and Kinkfur are on his paws, because he straight up REFUSED to give herbs to ShadowClan that could have saved them. He was putting EVERY ShadowClan cat in danger. He's a selfish ungrateful rat. That's not being a psychopath. It's being cruel. These are not synonyms. That Onestar is stymied by guilt and panic over just his son showing up is a shot through the heart of the psychopath theory.
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Onestar
Nov 14, 2019 16:53:07 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Nov 14, 2019 16:53:07 GMT -5
What about him wanting to bring the stoats onto ThunderClan territory? He even said that he was "leaving a gift" for them. Also, what about him telling his warriors to attack ThunderClan in their camp while they were asleep? To attack kits and elders? Also, the deaths of Wasptail, Crowfrost, and Kinkfur are on his paws, because he straight up REFUSED to give herbs to ShadowClan that could have saved them. He was putting EVERY ShadowClan cat in danger. He's a selfish ungrateful rat. That's not being a psychopath. It's being cruel. These are not synonyms. That Onestar is stymied by guilt and panic over just his son showing up is a shot through the heart of the psychopath theory. What about the times before Darktail? Most of these things happened before Darktail, and when he refused to give herbs to ShadowClan, he didn't even know that he was his son, so that can't be used as an excuse.
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Post by vectoring34 on Nov 14, 2019 17:53:32 GMT -5
That's not being a psychopath. It's being cruel. These are not synonyms. That Onestar is stymied by guilt and panic over just his son showing up is a shot through the heart of the psychopath theory. What about the times before Darktail? Most of these things happened before Darktail, and when he refused to give herbs to ShadowClan, he didn't even know that he was his son, so that can't be used as an excuse. I think you’re confused. I never said Darktail caused him to act like a heel, just that his reaction to him proves he’s not a psychopath like you claim. He felt guilt and shame, no psychopath can do that
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Onestar
Nov 14, 2019 18:10:03 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Nov 14, 2019 18:10:03 GMT -5
What about the times before Darktail? Most of these things happened before Darktail, and when he refused to give herbs to ShadowClan, he didn't even know that he was his son, so that can't be used as an excuse. I think you’re confused. I never said Darktail caused him to act like a heel, just that his reaction to him proves he’s not a psychopath like you claim. He felt guilt and shame, no psychopath can do that Oh okay He could have been acting though
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Post by *Ottersplash* on Nov 14, 2019 19:17:07 GMT -5
I don't think he's a psychopath. I mean, at one point, he was a good friend of Firestar, but being in a leadership position was obviously not for him. So I don't think he's a psychopath, but he's most definitely not a good cat either. What he did to Smoke isn't forgivable (though how she handled it wasn't right either)
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Onestar
Nov 14, 2019 19:21:28 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Nov 14, 2019 19:21:28 GMT -5
I don't think he's a psychopath. I mean, at one point, he was a good friend of Firestar, but being in a leadership position was obviously not for him. So I don't think he's a psychopath, but he's most definitely not a good cat either. What he did to Smoke isn't forgivable (though how she handled it wasn't right either) That is true I just don't understand how someone could do all those things he did. I can't understand, how he could take pleasure in sending the stoats over to ThunderClan, after thinking that they killed one of his warriors.
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Onestar
Nov 15, 2019 11:14:14 GMT -5
Post by vectoring34 on Nov 15, 2019 11:14:14 GMT -5
I don't think he's a psychopath. I mean, at one point, he was a good friend of Firestar, but being in a leadership position was obviously not for him. So I don't think he's a psychopath, but he's most definitely not a good cat either. What he did to Smoke isn't forgivable (though how she handled it wasn't right either) That is true I just don't understand how someone could do all those things he did. I can't understand, how he could take pleasure in sending the stoats over to ThunderClan, after thinking that they killed one of his warriors. Same reason as Leopardstar ordered her deputy to murder apprentices, Blackstar murdered Rosetail, Tigerheart wanting to drive out his neighbors, or Needletail abusing Violetshine. Cruelty and tyranny is sometimes just a thing that happens. And frankly, Onestar is morally better off than some of the cats I mentioned up there.
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Onestar
Nov 15, 2019 11:19:52 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Nov 15, 2019 11:19:52 GMT -5
That is true I just don't understand how someone could do all those things he did. I can't understand, how he could take pleasure in sending the stoats over to ThunderClan, after thinking that they killed one of his warriors. Same reason as Leopardstar ordered her deputy to murder apprentices, Blackstar murdered Rosetail, Tigerheart wanting to drive out his neighbors, or Needletail abusing Violetshine. Cruelty and tyranny is sometimes just a thing that happens. And frankly, Onestar is morally better off than some of the cats I mentioned up there. The difference between Blackstar and Onestar, is that when Blackstar did that, he was a deputy following his leader's orders, Onestar was a leader making his own orders. Also, didn't Rosetail's death happen during a battle? I'm not saying what Blackstar did was right or anything, because it wasn't. However, in Crowfeather's Trial, the book where Onestar did that crap, they made a BIG deal about the leader's word being law, and even though Harespring didn't agree with him, he went along with him because that's in the warrior code. Though, he did come to his senses in A Vision of Shadows, and went behind Onestar's back to give herbs to ShadowClan. I agree that Leopardstar and Needletail are trash
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Onestar
Nov 15, 2019 11:37:19 GMT -5
Post by vectoring34 on Nov 15, 2019 11:37:19 GMT -5
Same reason as Leopardstar ordered her deputy to murder apprentices, Blackstar murdered Rosetail, Tigerheart wanting to drive out his neighbors, or Needletail abusing Violetshine. Cruelty and tyranny is sometimes just a thing that happens. And frankly, Onestar is morally better off than some of the cats I mentioned up there. The difference between Blackstar and Onestar, is that when Blackstar did that, he was a deputy following his leader's orders, Onestar was a leader making his own orders. Also, didn't Rosetail's death happen during a battle? I'm not saying what Blackstar did was right or anything, because it wasn't. However, in Crowfeather's Trial, the book where Onestar did that crap, they made a BIG deal about the leader's word being law, and even though Harespring didn't agree with him, he went along with him because that's in the warrior code. Though, he did come to his senses in A Vision of Shadows, and went behind Onestar's back to give herbs to ShadowClan. I agree that Leopardstar and Needletail are trash Blackstar murdered Rosetail while he was robbing kits from the cradle. Rosetail was just an elder trying to defend them. I guess you could call it a battle, if fighting elders while stealing kits can be called as such. Following orders is not and never has been an excuse, especially when he clearly didn't see it as enough of a problem to stop what he was doing. The leader's word is law has been subverted multiple times. As you say, Harespring had a change of heart. Many cats in the broken code also did . Anyway, point is you can do horrible things and not be a psychopath. You're just a horrible person.
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Onestar
Nov 15, 2019 11:43:12 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Nov 15, 2019 11:43:12 GMT -5
The difference between Blackstar and Onestar, is that when Blackstar did that, he was a deputy following his leader's orders, Onestar was a leader making his own orders. Also, didn't Rosetail's death happen during a battle? I'm not saying what Blackstar did was right or anything, because it wasn't. However, in Crowfeather's Trial, the book where Onestar did that crap, they made a BIG deal about the leader's word being law, and even though Harespring didn't agree with him, he went along with him because that's in the warrior code. Though, he did come to his senses in A Vision of Shadows, and went behind Onestar's back to give herbs to ShadowClan. I agree that Leopardstar and Needletail are trash Blackstar murdered Rosetail while he was robbing kits from the cradle. Rosetail was just an elder trying to defend them. I guess you could call it a battle, if fighting elders while stealing kits can be called as such. Following orders is not and never has been an excuse, especially when he clearly didn't see it as enough of a problem to stop what he was doing. The leader's word is law has been subverted multiple times. As you say, Harespring had a change of heart. Many cats in the broken code also did . Anyway, point is you can do horrible things and not be a psychopath. You're just a horrible person. Oh, I thought she was killed in the fight that killed Lionheart and Spottedleaf, and all that. We've had so many arguments about Onestar, it's kind of funny lol
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Rainbow
Pandean
Ferncloud Deserves Better
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Onestar
Nov 15, 2019 12:01:16 GMT -5
Post by Pandean on Nov 15, 2019 12:01:16 GMT -5
I'm reading Crowfeather's Trial, and I'm beginning to think that Onestar might actually be a psychopath, like a legit psychopath. Maybe, the reason he turned on Firestar, was because after he gained leadership, he didn't need him anymore. Usually, after a psychopath has no use for someone, they toss them aside or worse. I could also be mixing up psychopath and sociopath, I know there are differences between the two, but I can't really remember which one is which. Anyway, I think it's hereditary too, so I'm honestly not surprised that Darktail is his son. Also, I remember on another thread, I said that Onestar wasn't that bad of a leader for WindClan, but I'm beginning to rethink that, he's letting his pride get in the way of helping his clan. psychopaths are born, sociopaths are made both lack empathy and suffer from Anti-Social Personality Disorder. However the way they portray the disorder is different. A psychopath is very controlled. You may not even know they're sick. They're usually able to not only work jobs but get high positions. Some may start families. They can fake emotion and empathy well. They usually are not overly impulsive and are very organized even with crime. A sociopath has no control. It's usually a lot more obvious. Most sociopaths cannot hold down jobs or relationships. They can't fake empathy and emotion or keep personal ties. They are overly impulsive which leads them to be very sloppy with crimes. Most sociopaths find their way to prison, eventually. So that's the difference, jsyk.
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Onestar
Nov 15, 2019 12:03:15 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Nov 15, 2019 12:03:15 GMT -5
I'm reading Crowfeather's Trial, and I'm beginning to think that Onestar might actually be a psychopath, like a legit psychopath. Maybe, the reason he turned on Firestar, was because after he gained leadership, he didn't need him anymore. Usually, after a psychopath has no use for someone, they toss them aside or worse. I could also be mixing up psychopath and sociopath, I know there are differences between the two, but I can't really remember which one is which. Anyway, I think it's hereditary too, so I'm honestly not surprised that Darktail is his son. Also, I remember on another thread, I said that Onestar wasn't that bad of a leader for WindClan, but I'm beginning to rethink that, he's letting his pride get in the way of helping his clan. psychopaths are born, sociopaths are made both lack empathy and suffer from Anti-Social Personality Disorder. However the way they portray the disorder is different. A psychopath is very controlled. You may not even know they're sick. They're usually able to not only work jobs but get high positions. Some may start families. They can fake emotion and empathy well. They usually are not overly impulsive and are very organized even with crime. A sociopath has no control. It's usually a lot more obvious. Most sociopaths cannot hold down jobs or relationships. They can't fake empathy and emotion or keep personal ties. They are overly impulsive which leads them to be very sloppy with crimes. Most sociopaths find their way to prison, eventually. So that's the difference, jsyk. Thanks That's what I thought, but I had them mixed up Isn't one born and one made by the events they grew up in?
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Onestar
Nov 15, 2019 12:32:06 GMT -5
Post by vectoring34 on Nov 15, 2019 12:32:06 GMT -5
Sociopath is a wastebin term that essentially means "anti-social behavior" but is ill-defined outside of that and really shouldn't be used in diagnosis. Psychopathy is slightly better defined but not by much.
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Onestar
Nov 16, 2019 19:54:30 GMT -5
Post by cowbird on Nov 16, 2019 19:54:30 GMT -5
I just think that being a leader really didnt do good to his character at all. That was one fatal decision on behalf of his predecessor
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Post by Deleted on Nov 16, 2019 19:57:08 GMT -5
I just think that being a leader really didnt do good to his character at all. That was one fatal decision on behalf of his predecessor That's true I just really hate how he changed, he went from being this nice guy who was easy to root for, to being the total opposite. Like, it's like Onewhisker and Onestar are two different characters. I know there was probably a good reason for his change, but it was still extremely disappointing.
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Onestar
Nov 16, 2019 20:05:56 GMT -5
Post by cowbird on Nov 16, 2019 20:05:56 GMT -5
I just think that being a leader really didnt do good to his character at all. That was one fatal decision on behalf of his predecessor That's true I just really hate how he changed, he went from being this nice guy who was easy to root for, to being the total opposite. Like, it's like Onewhisker and Onestar are two different characters. I know there was probably a good reason for his change, but it was still extremely disappointing. I 100% agree. There was some sort of bs explanation about why he switched up so fast but really there is no valid excuse for his behavior throughout the three arcs he was leader. Glad he is gone tbh.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 16, 2019 20:07:13 GMT -5
That's true I just really hate how he changed, he went from being this nice guy who was easy to root for, to being the total opposite. Like, it's like Onewhisker and Onestar are two different characters. I know there was probably a good reason for his change, but it was still extremely disappointing. I 100% agree. There was some sort of bs explanation about why he switched up so fast but really there is no valid excuse for his behavior throughout the three arcs he was leader. Glad he is gone tbh. Me too When I found out he died, I was like okay, whoever got rid of this guy is my new favorite character. Then...I read A Vision of Shadows, and I was like Okay...this guy might have killed my least favorite character, but he's not my new favorite character lol
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Onestar
Nov 16, 2019 20:21:33 GMT -5
Post by cowbird on Nov 16, 2019 20:21:33 GMT -5
I 100% agree. There was some sort of bs explanation about why he switched up so fast but really there is no valid excuse for his behavior throughout the three arcs he was leader. Glad he is gone tbh. Me too When I found out he died, I was like okay, whoever got rid of this guy is my new favorite character. Then...I read A Vision of Shadows, and I was like Okay...this guy might have killed my least favorite character, but he's not my new favorite character lol Im a very nostaligic person so when i looked that he was dead i was like well the last of the second generation leaders is dead but yeah i wasnt sad much, just really shocked when i discovered who it was.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 16, 2019 20:27:35 GMT -5
Me too When I found out he died, I was like okay, whoever got rid of this guy is my new favorite character. Then...I read A Vision of Shadows, and I was like Okay...this guy might have killed my least favorite character, but he's not my new favorite character lol Im a very nostaligic person so when i looked that he was dead i was like well the last of the second generation leaders is dead but yeah i wasnt sad much, just really shocked when i discovered who it was. Oh, that makes sense I just started reading the books last year, and I only recently started reading all the SEs and Novellas, so I'm not really nostalgic about anything, and everything is still pretty new to me.
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Onestar
Nov 16, 2019 20:35:15 GMT -5
Post by cowbird on Nov 16, 2019 20:35:15 GMT -5
Im a very nostaligic person so when i looked that he was dead i was like well the last of the second generation leaders is dead but yeah i wasnt sad much, just really shocked when i discovered who it was. Oh, that makes sense I just started reading the books last year, and I only recently started reading all the SEs and Novellas, so I'm not really nostalgic about anything, and everything is still pretty new to me. I lowkey envy you lmao. My emotional self is always harking back to the days when i first read the books and how attached i grew to all the OG characters and to see them go through all stages of life and then some passing on... it just makes me a mess lmaoo.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 16, 2019 20:40:56 GMT -5
Oh, that makes sense I just started reading the books last year, and I only recently started reading all the SEs and Novellas, so I'm not really nostalgic about anything, and everything is still pretty new to me. I lowkey envy you lmao. My emotional self is always harking back to the days when i first read the books and how attached i grew to all the OG characters and to see them go through all stages of life and then some passing on... it just makes me a mess lmaoo. I wish I could have read them way back when lol and that I hadn't spoiled myself Like, I already knew about the parents of Lionblaze and his siblings, and about a lot of cats dying, though, I was confused on how Brokenstar killed Ferncloud, since he had died in the first series, but after Omen of the Stars, I knew why. I also knew about Briarlight getting paralyzed, and Longtail dying. I guessed that Ashfur was the one who lured Firestar into the fox trap, so that's kind of a spoiler I guess lol. And all those spoilers happened, because I wanted to see if Dustpelt and Sandstorm were littermates. I wonder if I would have different opinions on certain characters, if I had read the books way back when
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Onestar
Nov 16, 2019 20:43:39 GMT -5
Post by cowbird on Nov 16, 2019 20:43:39 GMT -5
I lowkey envy you lmao. My emotional self is always harking back to the days when i first read the books and how attached i grew to all the OG characters and to see them go through all stages of life and then some passing on... it just makes me a mess lmaoo. I wish I could have read them way back when lol and that I hadn't spoiled myself Like, I already knew about the parents of Lionblaze and his siblings, and about a lot of cats dying, though, I was confused on how Brokenstar killed Ferncloud, since he had died in the first series, but after Omen of the Stars, I knew why. I also knew about Briarlight getting paralyzed, and Longtail dying. I guessed that Ashfur was the one who lured Firestar into the fox trap, so that's kind of a spoiler I guess lol. And all those spoilers happened, because I wanted to see if Dustpelt and Sandstorm were littermates. I wonder if I would have different opinions on certain characters, if I had read the books way back when You probably would cause you would read them in order and follow along like some of the others.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 16, 2019 20:47:31 GMT -5
I wish I could have read them way back when lol and that I hadn't spoiled myself Like, I already knew about the parents of Lionblaze and his siblings, and about a lot of cats dying, though, I was confused on how Brokenstar killed Ferncloud, since he had died in the first series, but after Omen of the Stars, I knew why. I also knew about Briarlight getting paralyzed, and Longtail dying. I guessed that Ashfur was the one who lured Firestar into the fox trap, so that's kind of a spoiler I guess lol. And all those spoilers happened, because I wanted to see if Dustpelt and Sandstorm were littermates. I wonder if I would have different opinions on certain characters, if I had read the books way back when You probably would cause you would read them in order and follow along like some of the others. Yeah true lol Wayyy back when, my sister had read some of them, and she told me about them, but I blew them off, because I thought they were just going to be like a martial arts type story, but with cats, and that would be ALL there was, so I wasn't very interested.
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