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Post by Alpha on Feb 19, 2017 12:38:44 GMT -5
I say he was. In Omens of the Stars, he caused two plots. His death caused Dawnpelt to think Jayfeather was a murderer, thus suspend Jayfeather from his duties. Jayfeather ignored that, so it was pointless. Flametail also helped mislead Jayfeather when he was looking for the fourth. I'd like to note that, in my opinion, 'the fourth' plot was fairly useless.
What about in not-OOTS? Well, I think his death had a role in AVOS. It made it so ShadowClan lost both of their medicine cats, and they had to get a fairly inexperienced medicine cat. That inexperienced medicine cat didn't know which herbs to use on yellow-cough, but that didn't really mean that Flametail or Littlecloud would've.
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Post by уυησ gαѕαι on Feb 19, 2017 14:07:54 GMT -5
That's probably the exact reason why. Most writers plan all the books, but if the Erins didn't, they probably had a good idea. Or maybe they just thought 'hey, since we killed flametail, we can get littlecloud to die and have a bad medicine cat replace him!!!!'.
Since I haven't read OOTS for a long time, I can't really remember anything, so I have nothing else to say.
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Post by wheeledwarrior on Feb 19, 2017 14:27:21 GMT -5
I think that his death was not pointless, but the way the books were written made it seem like it was...
The Erins stated on an early comment that having one or both medicine cats die and be left with only an apprentice would be interesting plot. Unfortunately, even though this is what happens in TAS, that plot point is not explored very much. So we don't really get to see what that's like. Other than Puddleshine's inexperience and being forced into a position of a medicine cat (which he somehow turned out to be good at and enjoys anyway), that plot point is never explored.
On the topic of Puddleshine's inexperience, would it have killed Rowanstar to let Leafpool stay for the duration of an entire apprenticeship? It's not like her Clan needed her immediately, because they already had Jayfeather and an apprentice of their own. We are not even shown the consequences of Puddleshine's rushed training, even though that could very well have some consequences down the line (such as getting herbs mixed up, not knowing what to do in a serious situation, or even having someone die).
On the topic of Puddleshine being a bad medicine cat, there's nothing really stating that he is. He seems to be good at his job, and enjoy it, with Leafpool commenting that he is good with his patients. As for the yellowcough epidemic, that was the disease no one had ever heard of before, so other medicine cats would be in the same situation. And the only reason it got out of control was because Onestar refused to hand over the herbs.
In reality, the whole thing with Flametail was just a bunch of wasted potential...
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#a3c5e6
Name Colour
𝓣𝓲𝓷𝓾𝓿𝓲𝓮𝓵
Warrior Fanatic
All hail me, the flower-flushing queen of Prague
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Post by 𝓣𝓲𝓷𝓾𝓿𝓲𝓮𝓵 on Feb 19, 2017 14:45:18 GMT -5
Not really since it was a somewhat major plot point and affected the next arc, but I guess they could've done more with it.
And I don't really see how Puddleshine is a bad medicine cat. Leafpool said she wasn't going to stay for long, so that rushed Puddleshine's training. That's not really his fault. And sure, he didn't know how to cure yellowcough, but no one knew about the disease or where to find a cure until Runningnose told him about it. Until then, he was trying his best to make sure no cats died and he would've been able to control the disease sooner had Onestar let ShadowClan have the herbs.
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Post by Pyropelt on Feb 19, 2017 15:10:02 GMT -5
On one hand, I wished Flametail wouldn't have died. On the other, I wish his death was written better in some areas.
Flametail could have helped train Puddleshine, so he would have had less stress.
The whole plot with Jayfeather losing his job, only to get it back later seemed weird. That didn't have to happen I think. Or Flametail could have revealed himself then, so Jayfeather wouldn't have had to give up his duty.
When it mentioned that he was hiding from Littlecloud, I thought that was a tiny bit cowardly.
I did like how Flametail decided to stand with the Clans against the Dark Forest though.
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Post by Mistybreeze on Feb 19, 2017 15:40:52 GMT -5
I have a feeling that we are going to get a Cinderpelt-type situation later on. Like Cinderpelt, Puddleshine wasn't destined to be a medicine cat. He was chosen at random. Sure he might be okay in the healing aspect, but I foresee problems with interpreting signs from StarClan. And wasn't there a concern that he didn't have the connection to StarClan in TAS? Didn't it take him forever to have his first dream?
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Post by Owlmoon on Feb 19, 2017 15:55:47 GMT -5
The way this was written really made it seem like it. But I dunno.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2017 17:55:03 GMT -5
Basically. It meant no sense for him to die either than Medicine Cat drama.
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Post by wheeledwarrior on Feb 19, 2017 18:28:03 GMT -5
MistybreezeThere was a concern that he didn't share the connection with Starclan, but he hasn't misinterpreted signs yet. And I don't remember the book saying that it was taking a long time for him to have his first dream from them. So I think he would be all right.
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Post by Mistybreeze on Feb 20, 2017 1:38:24 GMT -5
Mistybreeze There was a concern that he didn't share the connection with Starclan, but he hasn't misinterpreted signs yet. And I don't remember the book saying that it was taking a long time for him to have his first dream from them. So I think he would be all right. Cinderpelt didn't have problems initially either, but still got some things really wrong. Like the tiger and fire omen.
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Post by wheeledwarrior on Feb 20, 2017 11:00:11 GMT -5
Mistybreeze There was a concern that he didn't share the connection with Starclan, but he hasn't misinterpreted signs yet. And I don't remember the book saying that it was taking a long time for him to have his first dream from them. So I think he would be all right. Cinderpelt didn't have problems initially either, but still got some things really wrong. Like the tiger and fire omen. True. But as far as we know, that's the only thing she messed up. And it's not the first time someone has misinterpreted an omen (e.g. Fireheart in the first series thinking that “beware a warrior you cannot trust” referred to Greystripe, when it actually referred to Tigerclaw). Also, many cats have decided to be warriors before becoming medicine cats (even the former medicine cat of Shadowclan was one). Yellowfang and Mothwing aside, does that mean it wasn't their destiny to be medicine cats either?
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