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Post by nem on Nov 8, 2016 17:30:47 GMT -5
According to this paper from my Language Arts class, which took it from a website called USLegal.com, this is the definition of an insane person:
"Insanity is a mental illness of such a severe nature that a person cannot distinguish fantasy from reality, cannot manage his/her own affairs, or is subject to uncontrollable impulsive behavior."
If a person was insane at the time of the crime, that makes them "not guilty by reason of insanity." Which means that the person could not control themself(very well) when the crime was committed, thus they are not responsible. "He or she could not tell right from wrong or could not control his or her own behavior because of severe mental defect or illness."
I think so. Mapleshade thought her kits really wanted to avenge them because of the "visions" she kept on having. It was clearly all in her head(cannot distinguish fantasy from reality). Mapleshade showed almost no remorse or guilt while being with Appledusk, she barely thought it was wrong. Though she was nervous that the Clan would be unhappy that she is mates with Appledusk because he killed one of their warriors(could not tell right from wrong).
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Post by wheeledwarrior on Nov 8, 2016 19:56:56 GMT -5
Showing no remorse or guilt for something not legally insane (that's actually a different condition called sociopathy)… And if you think about it Mapleshade did show guilt at times, such as when her kits drowned… On top of that, she did understand right from wrong (that her relationship with Appledusk was wrong, especially considering the political situation her Clan was in). Mapleshade took care of her own affairs (her kits, and her Clan until her exile).
So no, she's not legally insane, at least not initially. The insanity, if you can call it that, starts after she loses her kits, mate, and home… The authors even point out that she is not actually ill, and only goes mad from the grief and having no one to help her cope with it… And considering how she acts before and after her exile, the official story seems to support this…
My personal headcanon is that she had psychosis (based on the illusions and how she acts after she dies), and the stress of losing everything she'd ever known along with having no support group caused it to rear its ugly head… Again, sociopathy could be another example, but the love for her kits and mate is genuine, so that's questionable…
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Post by ✲ριкαƒυєу✲ on Nov 8, 2016 20:06:58 GMT -5
I don't really agree with this theory.
Mapleshade was perfectly fine/sane before she became pregnant with kits. She lived a very normal life, and didn't act any different than the others. It wasn't until her kits died in front of her, and being exiled from both Clans--and also rejected by her mate--that she lost it. So I believe Mapleshade lost her sanity due to extreme sudden trauma, stress, guilt, and depression. She had nothing left to lose at this point. And she was bitter and spiteful towards the cats who caused all of this to happen--which she had every right to be.
Needless to say, Mapleshade was by no means "insane" from the start. She was perfectly normal up until those series of events. Most people put under that sort of trauma is bound to snap at some point. Mapleshade's insanity was circumstantial, no something she was born with.
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Post by ❅Maplefrost❅ on Nov 8, 2016 21:07:44 GMT -5
Honestly? Yeah, but I think it took steps in order for her to actually be considered insane. Losing her kits was probably the straw that broke the camel's back, or in this case, her mind.
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Post by sparklepaw on Nov 11, 2016 3:31:09 GMT -5
It's possible, and is a good observation, as I have thought about it myself.
Insanity is not a one-way street. To me she had semblances and traces of certain mental disorders from the beginning, with her seeming to have little to no problem with having Appledusk as a mate, and only a slight fear of consequences that might come. (Like someone above said, these are traits of sociopathy, which do not make you clinically "insane", but sociopathy essentially hurts someone's mind as to where they physically cannot grasp the reason why certain social standards exist, so they see no need to really abide by them.)
However, even having mental disorders does not entail that you are always insane. (I have a severe mental disorder myself.) It can come with mixed moods/episodes, etc., or you can be totally normal one moment, and then not the next. The only thing that really points to pure insanity was the hallucinations she had of her kits telling her to get revenge. This was psychosis, along with her delusions of persecution. This was triggered by a horrible event to happen to her.
And although I am extremely doubtful the Erins thought this hard, for many mental disorders, environmental experiences can be a trigger. It is slightly possible that all the grief she experienced finally made her snap, and her insanity come to the surface.
However, although possible, it is doubtful, and by no means could Mapleshade get off as clinically insane for everything she has done. The only possible time she could have gotten off for this is perhaps the delusions of her dead kits telling her to kill to get vengeance. Everything she does after this point comes from pure vengeance, and she definitely becomes a clinical psychopath at the end of all of this (as is seen in Crookedstar's Promise and other books). She does not care what she is doing anymore, but she does know what she is doing.
Does this make her insane? Yes, in a way. Psychopathy and sociopathy are certainly not things a sane person has, but not in the way that true "insanity" is, either.
So my opinion is no, she is not clinically insane by those standardized terms. She obviously isn't sane, but she does know what she is doing aside from the psychotic episode she had after her kits died.
Sorry for the rant! c":
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Post by appleleaf11 on Dec 5, 2016 22:45:30 GMT -5
I think I disagree that Mapleshade is insane. I understand she did go a bit too far, but I can tell you why I think she did. She didn't know what to do. Not many cats trusted her anymore,Her mate betrayed her,she is banished from her clan,and Riverclan doesn't except her, which meant she couldn't be with her mate, Appledusk again. She lost everything. She didn't know what else to do. She was alone and scared. She former friends and her mate even betrayed her. She felt like she had to commit murder to get revenge on those cats. I really could empathize with her.
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