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Post by ❅Maplefrost❅ on Mar 17, 2020 20:31:26 GMT -5
So a friend showed this to me yesterday, and I've watched it a few times. I really like the concept, and the song fits it well. It feels like a very "feel good" video, which isn't really common when it comes to Warrior Cat maps in general tbh. But I thought the idea behind this one was very creative, also the ending which is filled with a bunch of jokes and memes (graphic language warning for some), was pretty great too. Tldr the MAP is basically about OC characters saving or changing events in the story for the better. Here's a list of the full AU changes I found in the comments: ⭐️Part 1: MoodleDoodle- OC saves Ashfur from Hollyleaf
⭐️Part 2: DeerDrops - OC saves Whitestorm from Bone, leading him to become Whitestar
⭐️Part 3: Catart - OC saves Stormkit from breaking his jaw
⭐️Part 4: koskot owl - OC Owlheart saves Spottedleaf from Clawface
⭐️Part 5: Leaffii - OC Shadowheart repeatedly tries to stop Cloudpaw from going to eat kittypet food until they become so frustrated they just scare him off themself
⭐️Part 6: HarvestBrook - 3-legged OC Morningstar encourages Cinderpaw to pursue being a warrior despite her injury
⭐Part 7: CheekyTiger - OC Raylight prevents Sorrelkit from eating the deathberries and exposes Darkstripe! Will show Sorrelkit's future training to be a medicine cat if time allows
⭐️Part 8: mobiusghost - OC Ripleymoon leaves Alderpaw the correct herbs to heal Sandstorm's leg
⭐Part 9: InterstellarKip - OC Sootwhisker helps Needletail and Violetpaw escape, leading to Needletail becoming the leader of ShadowClan
⭐️Part 10: Chilly Weathers - OC Addermask saves Graypool from Tigerstar
⭐️Part 11: Kestrill - OC Fallowlight convinces Leafpool to be honest about being the three's mother to ThunderClan
⭐Part 12: GildedPhD - OC Sandpaw saving Badgerpaw/Badgerfang from his untimely demise!
⭐️Part 13: draghins - OC creates the sign for Mothwing BEFORE Hawkfrost does so that Mothwing’s faith isn’t shaken later because of his betrayal
⭐️Part 14: Lunala’s Mask - OC stops Tiny before he can lie about killing the dog
⭐Part 15: Cinnabarlab - OC Blizzardflight saves Flametail from drowning
⭐️Part 16: GiingerSnaps - OCs Halfpelt and Sunnymeadow (crowla) save Snowkit from the bird
⭐️Part 17: Helianthanas - OC Saffronmoon saves Shadowsight
⭐️Part 18: Hoywu - OC shows Yellowfang a safe way out of the fire
⭐Part 19: Sunflower Cougar - OC saves Mapleshade's kits
⭐️Part 20: Canarysong - OC leaves a sign for Onewhisker to bring Darkkit to WindClan with him to raise him there
⭐️Part 21: EJKraft - OC Oceloteyes takes the newly abandoned Sol and his siblings to be raised in modern SkyClan
⭐️Part 22: Miimsey - OC stops Sweetpaw, Rosepaw and Bluefur from eating the bad mouse
⭐️Part 23: RadButt - OC Flipleap catches the rabbit that blinds Longtail
⭐️Part 24: Jixxi - OC helps Swiftpaw up to safety in a tree with Brightpaw
⭐️Part 25: RachelAlexanDraws - OC Roseshadow saves Briarlight from the tree accident that paralyzed her
⭐️Part 26: Osinka - OC saves Feathertail from Sharp Tooth by scaring him with shadow play
⭐️Part 27: Gecko Draws - OC Leopardclaw saves Fallen Leaves from the flooding cave
⭐️Part 28: crowla - OCs Sunnymeadow and Halfpelt (Giingersnaps) lure a retiring age Half Moon through a portal to the present so her and Jayfeather can spend their last few years together
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Post by *Ottersplash* on Mar 17, 2020 20:59:36 GMT -5
I really love this MAP. The only two parts I don't love the concept of (not the art, that's wonderful) is Needletail becoming leader or Ashfur being saved from Hollyleaf (I feel it'd take more than that to make her stop)
The concept is still great tho
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Post by halogen on Mar 17, 2020 23:20:44 GMT -5
Also the Feathertail one - I doubt Sharptooth would just give up on going after the tribe forever. (And if Whitestorm became leader and Firestar still died when he did, he would end up even older than Mistystar)
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Post by ❅Maplefrost❅ on Mar 18, 2020 0:41:33 GMT -5
I really love this MAP. The only two parts I don't love the concept of (not the art, that's wonderful) is Needletail becoming leader or Ashfur being saved from Hollyleaf (I feel it'd take more than that to make her stop) The concept is still great tho Stopping Hollyleaf from killing Ashfur was probably more for Hollyleaf's sake. Killing him was the first step she took down a darker path, and it's something she genuinely felt guilty about. Enough for her to run away and isolate herself after threatening to kill Leafpool and revealing the secret. Ashfur wasn't Hollyleaf's to kill, and should have been dealt with more appropriately. There's also another part where they encourage Squirrelflight and Leafpool to tell the truth, so the Ashfur and Hollyleaf thing possibly won't even happen anyways.
As for Needletail, keep in mind she was still one of the very young cats who were influenced by older generation cats. Like the elders that talked badly of the current generation, the leader and mentors didn't teach them better discipline, and an outsider took advantage of their weaknesses. However, it's after Rain's death that Needletail gets a wake up call, and realizes that this isn't the right way for ShadowClan to change for the better. She paid for her mistakes with her life, and by saving Violetshine, but many, including myself even, felt she died too soon (Darktail too tbh), and her potential as a ShadowClan POV pretty much diminished. I'd much rather have seen her live, try to reedeem herself more, and help rebuild ShadowClan, but not the same as it was before hopefully a better one. Needletail being leader? I wouldn't mind, but it's something that has to be earned and proven for, I think she'd be a more interesting pick than Tigerstar at least.
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Post by ❅Maplefrost❅ on Mar 18, 2020 0:43:37 GMT -5
Also the Feathertail one - I doubt Sharptooth would just give up on going after the tribe forever. (And if Whitestorm became leader and Firestar still died when he did, he would end up even older than Mistystar) They could have just been doing that in the meantime to save Feathertail and the the other cats. They could later decide on a better plan to help the cats if they need too. Also Whitestorm was actually not that old when he died, back then in the first series is age would be considered old, but in the newer books, not so much. If anything he was only really killed off for the sake of making Graystripe the new deputy in the middle of the same battle.
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Post by halogen on Mar 18, 2020 11:59:05 GMT -5
Also the Feathertail one - I doubt Sharptooth would just give up on going after the tribe forever. (And if Whitestorm became leader and Firestar still died when he did, he would end up even older than Mistystar) They could have just been doing that in the meantime to save Feathertail and the the other cats. They could later decide on a better plan to help the cats if they need too. Also Whitestorm was actually not that old when he died, back then in the first series is age would be considered old, but in the newer books, not so much. If anything he was only really killed off for the sake of making Graystripe the new deputy in the middle of the same battle. He was still like a year older than Mistystar, and if this had happened he would have gotten his nine lives later than her, so I mean he would later on have the Mistystar problem but worse. (Also he was said to be nearly retiring, they just messed up the timeline in BP) And as for the Feathertail part, it still seems like a bad idea to just kick the can down the road and potentially risk lots of tribe cats' lives just to save Feathertail, when you know in the original timeline no more cats die besides her.
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Post by *Ottersplash* on Mar 18, 2020 12:28:22 GMT -5
I really love this MAP. The only two parts I don't love the concept of (not the art, that's wonderful) is Needletail becoming leader or Ashfur being saved from Hollyleaf (I feel it'd take more than that to make her stop) The concept is still great tho Stopping Hollyleaf from killing Ashfur was probably more for Hollyleaf's sake. Killing him was the first step she took down a darker path, and it's something she genuinely felt guilty about. Enough for her to run away and isolate herself after threatening to kill Leafpool and revealing the secret. Ashfur wasn't Hollyleaf's to kill, and should have been dealt with more appropriately. There's also another part where they encourage Squirrelflight and Leafpool to tell the truth, so the Ashfur and Hollyleaf thing possibly won't even happen anyways.
As for Needletail, keep in mind she was still one of the very young cats who were influenced by older generation cats. Like the elders that talked badly of the current generation, the leader and mentors didn't teach them better discipline, and an outsider took advantage of their weaknesses. However, it's after Rain's death that Needletail gets a wake up call, and realizes that this isn't the right way for ShadowClan to change for the better. She paid for her mistakes with her life, and by saving Violetshine, but many, including myself even, felt she died too soon (Darktail too tbh), and her potential as a ShadowClan POV pretty much diminished. I'd much rather have seen her live, try to reedeem herself more, and help rebuild ShadowClan, but not the same as it was before hopefully a better one. Needletail being leader? I wouldn't mind, but it's something that has to be earned and proven for, I think she'd be a more interesting pick than Tigerstar at least. I agree that her killing him was bad, but just moving him out of her way probably wouldn't have stopped her killing him in that moment. I'm aware of what Needletail did, and I respect that other people liked her, but I greatly dislike her and don't think she would have deserved to be leader after SHE was the one that was a big reason why Shadowclan fell in the first place.
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Post by jayfeather1234 on Mar 18, 2020 18:27:04 GMT -5
The only time travel related plot that I am hoping for is for the clans to unite as one group under Rock and for them to move to the mountains and the tribe would join them. They would leave after a group of Shaptooths move into the mountains. They would return to the lake where Rock would disappear in the tunnels and the group would worship him and the ancient ritual where a cat would enter the tunnels and try to find a way out would return and this would thus be creating a massive time loop. In the old Forest, the twolegs would leave and nature would take over. This would also be possible if Rock is the one blocking the clans connection to Starclan via the Moonpool. Another thing that could be revealed is that Mistystar is possessed by Rock.
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Post by ❅Maplefrost❅ on Mar 18, 2020 21:14:02 GMT -5
Stopping Hollyleaf from killing Ashfur was probably more for Hollyleaf's sake. Killing him was the first step she took down a darker path, and it's something she genuinely felt guilty about. Enough for her to run away and isolate herself after threatening to kill Leafpool and revealing the secret. Ashfur wasn't Hollyleaf's to kill, and should have been dealt with more appropriately. There's also another part where they encourage Squirrelflight and Leafpool to tell the truth, so the Ashfur and Hollyleaf thing possibly won't even happen anyways.
As for Needletail, keep in mind she was still one of the very young cats who were influenced by older generation cats. Like the elders that talked badly of the current generation, the leader and mentors didn't teach them better discipline, and an outsider took advantage of their weaknesses. However, it's after Rain's death that Needletail gets a wake up call, and realizes that this isn't the right way for ShadowClan to change for the better. She paid for her mistakes with her life, and by saving Violetshine, but many, including myself even, felt she died too soon (Darktail too tbh), and her potential as a ShadowClan POV pretty much diminished. I'd much rather have seen her live, try to reedeem herself more, and help rebuild ShadowClan, but not the same as it was before hopefully a better one. Needletail being leader? I wouldn't mind, but it's something that has to be earned and proven for, I think she'd be a more interesting pick than Tigerstar at least. I agree that her killing him was bad, but just moving him out of her way probably wouldn't have stopped her killing him in that moment. I'm aware of what Needletail did, and I respect that other people liked her, but I greatly dislike her and don't think she would have deserved to be leader after SHE was the one that was a big reason why Shadowclan fell in the first place. I mean, she did blind sight in the first place, ambushing and killing him, moving him out of the way could have easily given him time to evaluate the situation and escape and Hollyleaf a moment to realize her problems. And again, this scene probably won't happen anyways because there's another movement in the map where they encourage Leafpool to tell the truth.
Needletail wasn't the only reason why ShadowClan wasn't doing well, if anything the bigger reasons were cats like Rowanstar an Onestar, actual leaders with responsibilities. Saying that Needletail, who was incredibly young at the time, is the biggest reason for it falling a part is honestly giving her too much credit and making ShadowClan seem weaker than wet paper. The only major role Needletail had in the fall of ShadowClan was bringing back Violetshine, and being one of the teens that rebelled against the older generation, then later saving Violetshine again. What Needletail wanted was her Clan to become strong again and gained respect and fear like they did in the old days, in all the stories the elders would tell them. But ShadowClan to her at the time wasn't one she wanted to be in, and in all honesty it was a mess at the time. Rowanstar himself even acknowledged that he let them get away with things unpunished, and didn't listen much to the mentors about how the apprentices were behaving, etc. However, the bigger blame, if anything was on Onestar, who left them without the curing herb, losing good cats to death, and a leader in a weak state, enough for Onestar's own son to easily take advantage and take over after manipulating younger cats with false promises. There's a lot of reasons and events that led to the downfall of ShadowClan (including the Erin's pretty bad writing habits) but I don't think it's solely Needletail's fault, or majorly either.
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Post by *Ottersplash* on Mar 18, 2020 21:21:41 GMT -5
I agree that her killing him was bad, but just moving him out of her way probably wouldn't have stopped her killing him in that moment. I'm aware of what Needletail did, and I respect that other people liked her, but I greatly dislike her and don't think she would have deserved to be leader after SHE was the one that was a big reason why Shadowclan fell in the first place. I mean, she did blind sight in the first place, ambushing and killing him, moving him out of the way could have easily given him time to evaluate the situation and escape and Hollyleaf a moment to realize her problems. And again, this scene probably won't happen anyways because there's another movement in the map where they encourage Leafpool to tell the truth.
Needletail wasn't the only reason why ShadowClan wasn't doing well, if anything the bigger reasons were cats like Rowanstar an Onestar, actual leaders with responsibilities. Saying that Needletail, who was incredibly young at the time, is the biggest reason for it falling a part is honestly giving her too much credit and making ShadowClan seem weaker than wet paper. The only major role Needletail had in the fall of ShadowClan was bringing back Violetshine, and being one of the teens that rebelled against the older generation, then later saving Violetshine again. What Needletail wanted was her Clan to become strong again and gained respect and fear like they did in the old days, in all the stories the elders would tell them. But ShadowClan to her at the time wasn't one she wanted to be in, and in all honesty it was a mess at the time. Rowanstar himself even acknowledged that he let them get away with things unpunished, and didn't listen much to the mentors about how the apprentices were behaving, etc. However, the bigger blame, if anything was on Onestar, who left them without the curing herb, losing good cats to death, and a leader in a weak state, enough for Onestar's own son to easily take advantage and take over after manipulating younger cats with false promises. There's a lot of reasons and events that led to the downfall of ShadowClan (including the Erin's pretty bad writing habits) but I don't think it's solely Needletail's fault, or majorly either. I think we'll just have to agree to disagree on the Needletail thing. I find her to be extremely unlikable to begin with, so her being leader is the last thing I want
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Post by ❅Maplefrost❅ on Mar 18, 2020 21:54:47 GMT -5
They could have just been doing that in the meantime to save Feathertail and the the other cats. They could later decide on a better plan to help the cats if they need too. Also Whitestorm was actually not that old when he died, back then in the first series is age would be considered old, but in the newer books, not so much. If anything he was only really killed off for the sake of making Graystripe the new deputy in the middle of the same battle. He was still like a year older than Mistystar, and if this had happened he would have gotten his nine lives later than her, so I mean he would later on have the Mistystar problem but worse. (Also he was said to be nearly retiring, they just messed up the timeline in BP) And as for the Feathertail part, it still seems like a bad idea to just kick the can down the road and potentially risk lots of tribe cats' lives just to save Feathertail, when you know in the original timeline no more cats die besides her. I can see what you mean. But Whitestorm and Mistystar were both warriors at the same time, and again Whitestorm was considered "old" back then would be ridiculous nowadays. He only died at about 6 years, when nowadays you have cats like Squirrelflight who lived much longer, and people still want her to become leader. Also, leaders still lose lives to age, but according to the Erins, Mistystar (as ridiculous as it is) apparently won't die any time soon. The Erins don't really seem to understand the concept of aging in the series. If Whitestorm had become leader, it would honestly be more of an older Reedwhisker situation, some people also want him to actually become leader too. But I can see what you mean, I personally didn't think Firestar should have become deputy after Tigerstar, I would have been more satisfied with Whitestorm.
As for the Tribe cats, honestly they didn't really deserve Feathertail's sacrifice. They were pretty ungrateful, and were wiling to use force before to force Stormfur t help him, and were being very cult like. Feathertail would have been better off alive for the story honestly, instead of dying for the sake of a cult tribe. Her character could have been fleshed out better, Stormfur would have stayed with the clans, and Crowfeather's character wouldn't have spiraled downhill. I think it's better off of them to try and regroup and do a more logical situation to getting rid of Sharptooth.
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Post by ❅Maplefrost❅ on Mar 18, 2020 21:59:02 GMT -5
I mean, she did blind sight in the first place, ambushing and killing him, moving him out of the way could have easily given him time to evaluate the situation and escape and Hollyleaf a moment to realize her problems. And again, this scene probably won't happen anyways because there's another movement in the map where they encourage Leafpool to tell the truth.
Needletail wasn't the only reason why ShadowClan wasn't doing well, if anything the bigger reasons were cats like Rowanstar an Onestar, actual leaders with responsibilities. Saying that Needletail, who was incredibly young at the time, is the biggest reason for it falling a part is honestly giving her too much credit and making ShadowClan seem weaker than wet paper. The only major role Needletail had in the fall of ShadowClan was bringing back Violetshine, and being one of the teens that rebelled against the older generation, then later saving Violetshine again. What Needletail wanted was her Clan to become strong again and gained respect and fear like they did in the old days, in all the stories the elders would tell them. But ShadowClan to her at the time wasn't one she wanted to be in, and in all honesty it was a mess at the time. Rowanstar himself even acknowledged that he let them get away with things unpunished, and didn't listen much to the mentors about how the apprentices were behaving, etc. However, the bigger blame, if anything was on Onestar, who left them without the curing herb, losing good cats to death, and a leader in a weak state, enough for Onestar's own son to easily take advantage and take over after manipulating younger cats with false promises. There's a lot of reasons and events that led to the downfall of ShadowClan (including the Erin's pretty bad writing habits) but I don't think it's solely Needletail's fault, or majorly either. I think we'll just have to agree to disagree on the Needletail thing. I find her to be extremely unlikable to begin with, so her being leader is the last thing I want I mean you can still find her unlikable as a leader either way. A lot of people praise Blackstar for being a good leader, but I personally find him extremely unlikable and didn't think he should have been leader in the first place, and I still believe that. But it doesn't change the fact that he was the most stable leader ShadowClan had for a while. Same can be said for Tigerheartstar. In fact, the only likeable leaders to me right now are Leafstar and Harestar, the others I personally don't like and therefore don't care for.
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Post by halogen on Mar 21, 2020 13:55:33 GMT -5
He was still like a year older than Mistystar, and if this had happened he would have gotten his nine lives later than her, so I mean he would later on have the Mistystar problem but worse. (Also he was said to be nearly retiring, they just messed up the timeline in BP) And as for the Feathertail part, it still seems like a bad idea to just kick the can down the road and potentially risk lots of tribe cats' lives just to save Feathertail, when you know in the original timeline no more cats die besides her. I can see what you mean. But Whitestorm and Mistystar were both warriors at the same time, and again Whitestorm was considered "old" back then would be ridiculous nowadays. He only died at about 6 years, when nowadays you have cats like Squirrelflight who lived much longer, and people still want her to become leader. Also, leaders still lose lives to age, but according to the Erins, Mistystar (as ridiculous as it is) apparently won't die any time soon. The Erins don't really seem to understand the concept of aging in the series. If Whitestorm had become leader, it would honestly be more of an older Reedwhisker situation, some people also want him to actually become leader too. But I can see what you mean, I personally didn't think Firestar should have become deputy after Tigerstar, I would have been more satisfied with Whitestorm.
As for the Tribe cats, honestly they didn't really deserve Feathertail's sacrifice. They were pretty ungrateful, and were wiling to use force before to force Stormfur t help him, and were being very cult like. Feathertail would have been better off alive for the story honestly, instead of dying for the sake of a cult tribe. Her character could have been fleshed out better, Stormfur would have stayed with the clans, and Crowfeather's character wouldn't have spiraled downhill. I think it's better off of them to try and regroup and do a more logical situation to getting rid of Sharptooth. I think you are underestimating how difficult it is to get rid of a mountain lion when you are just a group of regular cats. When a giant like 10 times your size is hunting down you and your family and killing them, it's hard to calmly decide on a rational way to defeat them without killing anyone in the process - Talon and the other exiles certainly tried. The book seemed to be clear that they tried every logical solution already. Do you really think all of them, even the kits, deserved to die because they did some cruel things out of utter desperation against a threat that is honestly worse than almost anything the Clans have ever faced? (Especially since we see in Tawnypelt's Clan that they are a lot more reasonable when they are under different leadership). I agree that it might have been better for the story if Feathertail lived, but that's different than saying it's morally right to sacrifice the whole tribe just to save Feathertail.
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Post by ❅Maplefrost❅ on Mar 22, 2020 4:14:21 GMT -5
I can see what you mean. But Whitestorm and Mistystar were both warriors at the same time, and again Whitestorm was considered "old" back then would be ridiculous nowadays. He only died at about 6 years, when nowadays you have cats like Squirrelflight who lived much longer, and people still want her to become leader. Also, leaders still lose lives to age, but according to the Erins, Mistystar (as ridiculous as it is) apparently won't die any time soon. The Erins don't really seem to understand the concept of aging in the series. If Whitestorm had become leader, it would honestly be more of an older Reedwhisker situation, some people also want him to actually become leader too. But I can see what you mean, I personally didn't think Firestar should have become deputy after Tigerstar, I would have been more satisfied with Whitestorm.
As for the Tribe cats, honestly they didn't really deserve Feathertail's sacrifice. They were pretty ungrateful, and were wiling to use force before to force Stormfur t help him, and were being very cult like. Feathertail would have been better off alive for the story honestly, instead of dying for the sake of a cult tribe. Her character could have been fleshed out better, Stormfur would have stayed with the clans, and Crowfeather's character wouldn't have spiraled downhill. I think it's better off of them to try and regroup and do a more logical situation to getting rid of Sharptooth. I think you are underestimating how difficult it is to get rid of a mountain lion when you are just a group of regular cats. When a giant like 10 times your size is hunting down you and your family and killing them, it's hard to calmly decide on a rational way to defeat them without killing anyone in the process - Talon and the other exiles certainly tried. The book seemed to be clear that they tried every logical solution already. Do you really think all of them, even the kits, deserved to die because they did some cruel things out of utter desperation against a threat that is honestly worse than almost anything the Clans have ever faced? (Especially since we see in Tawnypelt's Clan that they are a lot more reasonable when they are under different leadership). I agree that it might have been better for the story if Feathertail lived, but that's different than saying it's morally right to sacrifice the whole tribe just to save Feathertail. I think you're taking the map too literally when it's literally just for fun.
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Post by halogen on Mar 22, 2020 10:38:03 GMT -5
I think you are underestimating how difficult it is to get rid of a mountain lion when you are just a group of regular cats. When a giant like 10 times your size is hunting down you and your family and killing them, it's hard to calmly decide on a rational way to defeat them without killing anyone in the process - Talon and the other exiles certainly tried. The book seemed to be clear that they tried every logical solution already. Do you really think all of them, even the kits, deserved to die because they did some cruel things out of utter desperation against a threat that is honestly worse than almost anything the Clans have ever faced? (Especially since we see in Tawnypelt's Clan that they are a lot more reasonable when they are under different leadership). I agree that it might have been better for the story if Feathertail lived, but that's different than saying it's morally right to sacrifice the whole tribe just to save Feathertail. I think you're taking the map too literally when it's literally just for fun. I was only doing that in response to ottersplash's comment criticizing the Needltail and Hollyleaf scenarios, which made me think if there were any others that wouldn't quite work out.
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