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Post by vectoring34 on Jul 17, 2019 13:42:49 GMT -5
Thistleclaw is one I feel gets unfairly nailed in a showing of huge double standards Compared to which cat? Could you be more specific? Dustpelt and Snowbird come to mind as a rather large example of double standards when it comes to apprentices and warriors. That's the biggest and most obvious one. However, even among villains too, Thistleclaw gets way too much flak. No other character has art/videos of an AU that consists purely of "this character is betrayed by their loved ones and viciously murdered" and garner a huge positive reception in them.
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Post by whiteflight on Jul 17, 2019 16:02:36 GMT -5
Crowfeather, Jayfeather, Ivypool, Daisy, Leafpool (I've seen the dislike on her growing).
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Lesbian
satanael
are you girls ready? let’s go!
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Post by satanael on Jul 17, 2019 16:02:39 GMT -5
while i’m more neutral on millie, the fandom gives her way too much flack. overall a lot of readers seem to be either totally unsympathetic to characters’ grief, or have extreme expectations regarding it, and millie gets the short end of both sticks.
she was never abusive to blossomfall - one of her kits almost died and suffered a life-changing injury as a result, and naturally became upset / over-protective for awhile. blossomfall behaved without sympathy for her mother or her sister during an extremely stressful time: why is millie shamed for snapping?
on the other hand, this fandom seems to reeaally hate it when cats get second mates after their old one dies. it’s almost as if most people can finish grieving for past relationships and move on.
i also don’t understand why people like to call needletail abusive, when she’s actually a really great and realistic character.
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Post by Ivyfalcon on Jul 17, 2019 16:11:08 GMT -5
Hollyleaf, Twigbranch, Ivypool, Dovewing, Jayfeather, Thunderstar, and Bramblestar. I like Mapleshade as a villan, but I don't condone her actions.
I'm neutral on a lot of the others mentioned on here as well.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 17, 2019 17:29:12 GMT -5
Leafpool, Daisy, Bumblestripe, and Blossomfall
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#FCCA57
star_green.png
Name Colour, Custom Stars
Papillon
Forum Pest
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Post by Papillon on Jul 17, 2019 18:20:01 GMT -5
Dovewing and Tigerheart.
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Post by embertuft on Jul 19, 2019 2:12:01 GMT -5
I love Lionblaze, even if he is a bit boring. Millie is actually okay to me, which is surprising because I also LOVE Blossomfall. Crowfeather is one of my faves. I’m neutral with Breezepelt, I don’t hate him I guess.
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Post by maiareadswarriors on Jul 19, 2019 3:50:14 GMT -5
Correct me if these aren't actually hated but...I love Crowfeather Jayfeather Lionblaze Leafpool Blackstar ... I feel like they're all great cats and I don't know why people give them such bad raps.
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Post by Skypaw13 on Jul 19, 2019 4:09:31 GMT -5
Correct me if these aren't actually hated but...I love Crowfeather Jayfeather Lionblaze Leafpool Blackstar ... I feel like they're all great cats and I don't know why people give them such bad raps. I love all these cats as well. The reasons I typically see for not liking them are Crowfeather's a bad father and annoying, Jayfeather is too mean (and annoying), Lionblaze is boring, Leafpool acted like a jerk in the third series and was an idiot before that, and Blackstar is a literal murderer. I either don't agree with the reasons or I look past them and love the character anyway.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2019 6:49:34 GMT -5
Bramblestar, and I don't think he deserves being possessed and dying without ever reclaiming himself like most fans seem to want to happen, after all he's been through. cx
Millie, but I don't love her. Just like 'hey that one is not bad'. I just feel she was hated on to an extreme for awhile there.
Tigerheart x Dovewing as a pairing; but note I haven't read those books, I'm talking of the concept of a forbidden romance finally doing the right thing once they've gone too far; one moves to the other's clan. Also, I think Dovewing didn't really like her life in ThunderClan, but that could be my own headcanon.
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Post by ❅Maplefrost❅ on Jul 19, 2019 12:23:24 GMT -5
while i’m more neutral on millie, the fandom gives her way too much flack. overall a lot of readers seem to be either totally unsympathetic to characters’ grief, or have extreme expectations regarding it, and millie gets the short end of both sticks. she was never abusive to blossomfall - one of her kits almost died and suffered a life-changing injury as a result, and naturally became upset / over-protective for awhile. blossomfall behaved without sympathy for her mother or her sister during an extremely stressful time: why is millie shamed for snapping? on the other hand, this fandom seems to reeaally hate it when cats get second mates after their old one dies. it’s almost as if most people can finish grieving for past relationships and move on. i also don’t understand why people like to call needletail abusive, when she’s actually a really great and realistic character. The Erins literally confirmed she indeed was abusive though, whether she did it intentionally or not, it was still abuse. Neglect is a form of abuse, and she neglected both Blossomfall and Bumblestripe, it doesn't matter how old they are, that doesn't excuse her behavior. And her being over-protective of Briarlight was no better because she was coming off as an ableist parent, which disabled people, like myself, have to unfortunately put up with a lot irl. And the reason people give Millie flake is not because she became Graystripe's new mate really, but mostly due to her treatment of his kits, and how the whole situation wasn't properly resolved on screen. And as much as I don't mind and even like Needletail to a degree, yes she's a realistic character, but that doesn't excuse that she was indeed abusive toward Violetshine. She manipulated Violetshine, was mentally abusive to her, but ironically was manipulated herself as a young as well by cats like Darktail and Rain. While also dealing with a traumatic experience as a kit, but this doesn't excuse her behavior either, it just makes it more understandable as to why she did it.
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Post by vectoring34 on Jul 19, 2019 13:03:24 GMT -5
while i’m more neutral on millie, the fandom gives her way too much flack. overall a lot of readers seem to be either totally unsympathetic to characters’ grief, or have extreme expectations regarding it, and millie gets the short end of both sticks. she was never abusive to blossomfall - one of her kits almost died and suffered a life-changing injury as a result, and naturally became upset / over-protective for awhile. blossomfall behaved without sympathy for her mother or her sister during an extremely stressful time: why is millie shamed for snapping? on the other hand, this fandom seems to reeaally hate it when cats get second mates after their old one dies. it’s almost as if most people can finish grieving for past relationships and move on. i also don’t understand why people like to call needletail abusive, when she’s actually a really great and realistic character. The Erins literally confirmed she indeed was abusive though, whether she did it intentionally or not, it was still abuse. Neglect is a form of abuse, and she neglected both Blossomfall and Bumblestripe, it doesn't matter how old they are, that doesn't excuse her behavior. And her being over-protective of Briarlight was no better because she was coming off as an ableist parent, which disabled people, like myself, have to unfortunately put up with a lot irl. And the reason people give Millie flake is not because she became Graystripe's new mate really, but mostly due to her treatment of his kits, and how the whole situation wasn't properly resolved on screen. And as much as I don't mind and even like Needletail to a degree, yes she's a realistic character, but that doesn't excuse that she was indeed abusive toward Violetshine. She manipulated Violetshine, was mentally abusive to her, but ironically was manipulated herself as a young as well by cats like Darktail and Rain. While also dealing with a traumatic experience as a kit, but this doesn't excuse her behavior either, it just makes it more understandable as to why she did it. Calling a parent not being 100% invested in their adult child's life neglectful would make basically 90% of parents neglectful. Most parents don't coddle their children into adulthood, it's part of growing up to stop needing said coddling. That's precisely why Millie's treatment of Briarlight was, if well-intentioned, a mistake. Neglect is abuse only under very specific circumstances, not telling your adult children to get with the program and live their own lives.
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Lesbian
satanael
are you girls ready? let’s go!
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Post by satanael on Jul 19, 2019 20:34:39 GMT -5
an author’s opinion shouldn’t be treated as holy scripture. when it comes to warriors, there are five(?) separate contributors with their own drastically different opinions and authorial biases. until these ladies learn how to concisely agree on physical descriptions, timelines or barebones personality traits, i’m not going to accept their 3am thoughts on as subjective as abuse as canon.
based on the content in the books: the medicine cats had never dealt with paraplegia before and didn’t expect briarlight to live very long. millie was a distraught mother doing everything she could to help her, and blossomfall’s self-servicing behaviour pushed her to her last nerve. they were young adults at the time of briarlight’s injury: far too old to be sulking and calling neglect when everyone thought their sister would drop dead.
(which in itself kinda sounds like another ableist narrative from the erins but shkdhsk i’m NOT about to spend my friday night picking this series apart)
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Post by ❅Maplefrost❅ on Jul 20, 2019 6:56:12 GMT -5
But there's a difference between irl real world and how human society works, and how a clan works. They literally stay in the same groups for almost if not all their life, they don't just turn 18 and leave to live up their own new lives. It's not the same, so I don't know why people think that Millie verbally abusing her daughter is okay. Especially when it's shown in comparison to how Whitewing treated Ivypool right before. On top of that it got to the point where Blossomfall was mentally self-destructive because of her mother's treatment of her. She literally almost died and her mother could care less apparently, which got Blossomfall into the state of mind of wondering if her mother would even care if she died. Or thinking that she deserved to be in the literal equivalent of cat hell because she thinks of herself as a horrible person. Also fyi, there is such a thing as the "Word of God" trope. [ X] There being more than one author doesn't really change that some things from the writers can be taken as solid, and even listed into the wikia because of that. But it also doesn't mean they can't have different opinions, but different opinions doesn't negate the word of the other authors. Whatever you want to classify it, it doesn't make Millie's behavior toward Blossomfall morally right. But it also doesn't mean that what Blossomfall did was okay either. Just that Millie, imo, is an awful mother with how she treated her litter, and the whole situation was just simply glossed over and not really properly solved on screen. Being okay with the Erins word of them being back on good terms but also not accepting that they said Millie is a neglectful/abusive parent doesn't make sense imo. It's like picking and choosing what you want to believe.
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Lesbian
satanael
are you girls ready? let’s go!
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Post by satanael on Jul 20, 2019 7:16:53 GMT -5
i’m not going to keep repeating myself because we both seem to have very different ideas on how much time it takes to be considered abusive. in my conclusive opinion, a few high-stress months and a singular shouting incident =/= anything close to abuse.
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Post by ❅Maplefrost❅ on Jul 20, 2019 8:12:11 GMT -5
I mean that's your opinion, but as someone who's been a victim of abuse, especially in a parental/child relationships, I don't tolerate Millie's behavior. But again that's just my opinion. We'll have to agree to disagree.
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Bisexual
Fawnwing
Tree is good, you guys are just mean
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Post by Fawnwing on Jul 22, 2019 3:40:53 GMT -5
Tree. That's it. Just Tree. A lot of people seem to dislike him ^_^
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