|
Post by bumblewing1011 on Mar 11, 2024 23:42:00 GMT -5
In my opinion no because bumble stripe only wanted love from dove
|
|
|
Post by Woofzie on Mar 12, 2024 0:08:55 GMT -5
Yes and I will fight anyone in this matter.
He was an absolute jerk from time to time, pushing Dovewing to her limit and did not respect her boundaries. And let me say this clear before anything: Dovewing it's at fault too, she's not an innocent angel who did nothing wrong. She didn't establish her limits from the beginning, and when she tried to, it was too late and she, obviously snapped. And she DID lead on Bumblestripe, but to be fair, the amount of social pressure from everyone was tiring even for me.
Back on Bumblestripe. My God. I am/was in the same position he was, being in love with your friend and let me say this clear and loud. Loving someone doesn't mean they HAVE to return your feelings. They have NO obligation to you or the expectations your own head creates. He had zero interest in what she was feeling and just talked about what he wanted and expected. And no, the typical argument of "uh, they just did it to make Tigerheart look better" doesn't work. And MORE if you look now what a mess is the character of Tigerstar now. He was always a pushy, entitled man and AT LEAST he didn't go the Ashfur route but still, what a piece of garbage.
|
|
|
Post by kitters on Mar 12, 2024 0:11:50 GMT -5
He was very pushy and invasive. They had one cute scene under the flowers which I thought was nice and I almost shipped them for a second. But she needed to send a strong message or he wouldn't get it.. and rosepetal was out of line in that one scene too
|
|
#a3c5e6
Name Colour
𝓣𝓲𝓷𝓾𝓿𝓲𝓮𝓵
Warrior Fanatic
All hail me, the flower-flushing queen of Prague
|
Post by 𝓣𝓲𝓷𝓾𝓿𝓲𝓮𝓵 on Mar 12, 2024 0:20:24 GMT -5
I honestly think he does. While by no means as bad as someone like, say, Ashfur, Bumblestripe wasn't exactly some innocent angel, either. It's a shame too, because he and Dovewing could've been really cute together.
|
|
#a3c5e6
Name Colour
𝓣𝓲𝓷𝓾𝓿𝓲𝓮𝓵
Warrior Fanatic
All hail me, the flower-flushing queen of Prague
|
Post by 𝓣𝓲𝓷𝓾𝓿𝓲𝓮𝓵 on Mar 12, 2024 0:30:47 GMT -5
And no, the typical argument of "uh, they just did it to make Tigerheart look better" doesn't work. And MORE if you look now what a mess is the character of Tigerstar now. He was always a pushy, entitled man and AT LEAST he didn't go the Ashfur route but still, what a piece of garbage. It always annoys me to no end whenever people bring up the Tigerheart thing. Yeah, Bumblestripe was written a certain way to make Dovewing's other love interest look better by comparison, that much has always been obvious. It's (unfortunately) a very common thing to do with love triangles. And? It's not like that changes the fact he acted way out of line literally right after Purdy died! And it'd be one thing if he and Dovewing came to an understanding, but they never really did. He just tells her to think about his offer even after she snaps at him over it and then leaves.
|
|
|
Post by carbonfoot on Mar 12, 2024 7:37:00 GMT -5
I think it's pretty reasonable to not like someone when they're the kind of guy to suggest that you should have kids during your grandpa's funeral
Even if Bumblestripe is just "doing it out of love", that doesn't mean any of his behavior is excusable. If he really loved Dovewing then he would respect her boundaries like any good and trustworthy person should
|
|
Non-binary
flipwish
my kitten can shake hands. can brambleclaw do that? no
|
Post by flipwish on Mar 12, 2024 8:03:05 GMT -5
Is it sad to say I'm pleasantly surprised by the current poll results??? I'm so baffled by the "to make Tigerheart look better" excuse like genuinely I do not give a shit about Tigerheart, it's still canon that Bumble is an invasive loser. It's really not impressive to be better than Ashfur- NOT being a murderer is below the bare minimum
|
|
Asexual
#E0C6FF
Name Colour
Slightdapple
✨your local book nerd ✨
|
Post by Slightdapple on Mar 12, 2024 10:41:31 GMT -5
Yes. I hate when people say that he was written like that to make Tigerheart seem better. He was, but that still doesn't excuse his actions.
|
|
|
Post by Wolfyy- on Mar 12, 2024 12:46:57 GMT -5
Hate, no. Dislike? Sure.
|
|
|
Post by کیوان on Mar 12, 2024 12:53:34 GMT -5
We all know she should've gone with neither, tbh
|
|
|
Post by Moonblazer on Mar 12, 2024 13:28:23 GMT -5
I don't think he really deserves to be like loathed and crucified. I think he genuinely loved Dovewing, asked an insensitive question at a bad time, and backed off when he was scolded about it. Nobody owes you a relationship of course, and I don't blame Dovewing for not returning feelings for him if she did not love him in the same way. What bothered me so much about Dovwing's part in all this was just how often she unfairly compared every single thing Bumblestripe did to Tigerheart. She constantly treated him like an afterthought even though she willingly entered a relationship with him. She was unkind and impatient no matter what Bumblestripe did, even if he didn't do anything wrong at all or just wanted to be active in their two-way relationship.
I do feel bad that Bumblestripe was never told why he was dumped until Dovewing waltzed into camp with Tigerheart and their kits. And even then, Bumblestripe wished her the best and got over it, and now rightfully sees her as a Shadowclan cat, unwelcome in the Clan she left behind.
I think at times the fandom will vilify him far too much while infantilizing Dovewing's clear lack of communication and constant unhealthy comparisons while she was actively in a relationship with Bumblestripe. As for the being written to cater to Tigerheart, that's literally every single cat in the series being written as at that point, so that's not my main concern at all. I just really hated how Dovewing treated Bumblestripe when they were mates. It was needlessly unkind. I don't think Dovewing should have been with anybody tbh. She would have been a much better character if she had stayed single.
|
|
|
Post by Saint Ambrosef on Mar 12, 2024 15:42:19 GMT -5
Tbh it is really hard for me to critically analyze Bumblestripe’s actions in any regard because I cannot divest his actions from what to me is unforgivably neurotic writing. His characterization flips back and forth between novels and depends so heavily on which author wrote the book that I get whiplash. It’s hard to judge his character because like, which version do you choose as the “real” one? Because the two different versions of him (Kate vs Cherith) don’t feel reconcilable.
|
|
|
Post by iceheart on Mar 12, 2024 15:49:57 GMT -5
No. He asked an insensitive question and then apologized and didn't bring it up again. Characters have flaws. He's not perfect even though he's written inconsistently. Other than that, he's much more supportive of her - especially in The Forgotten Warrior and Bramblestar's Storm when he tells Bramblestar what's happening to her. Althouh I don't want to victim blame, this is a fault of the narrative. Dovewing isn't shown to despise him until what happened at Purdy's funeral, and it's so funny to me because in that same scene, Tigerheart says something along the same lines and it's suddenly fine. I never got the hate over Bumblestripe because it seems exaggerated for a single scene that was written WAY OOC for him. I'll say this over and over - he's only torn down to make Tigerheart look like Romeo, and although yes several other cats were done dirty like that too, Bumblestripe was the worst of them all since he was her direct competitor for Tigerheart.
|
|
|
Post by Jaysnow on Mar 12, 2024 15:53:44 GMT -5
No. He asked an insensitive question and then apologized and didn't bring it up again. Characters have flaws. He's not perfect even though he's written inconsistently. Other than that, he's much more supportive of her - especially in The Forgotten Warrior and Bramblestar's Storm when he tells Bramblestar what's happening to her. Althouh I don't want to victim blame, this is a fault of the narrative. Dovewing isn't shown to despise him until what happened at Purdy's funeral, and it's so funny to me because in that same scene, Tigerheart says something along the same lines and it's suddenly fine. I never got the hate over Bumblestripe because it seems exaggerated for a single scene that was written WAY OOC for him. I'll say this over and over - he's only torn down to make Tigerheart look like Romeo, and although yes several other cats were done dirty like that too, Bumblestripe was the worst of them all since he was her direct competitor for Tigerheart. Wasn't asking it on Purdy's grave kind of strange, though?
|
|
|
Post by Hollyfall on Mar 12, 2024 16:54:37 GMT -5
No. He asked an insensitive question and then apologized and didn't bring it up again. Characters have flaws. He's not perfect even though he's written inconsistently. Other than that, he's much more supportive of her - especially in The Forgotten Warrior and Bramblestar's Storm when he tells Bramblestar what's happening to her. Althouh I don't want to victim blame, this is a fault of the narrative. Dovewing isn't shown to despise him until what happened at Purdy's funeral, and it's so funny to me because in that same scene, Tigerheart says something along the same lines and it's suddenly fine. I never got the hate over Bumblestripe because it seems exaggerated for a single scene that was written WAY OOC for him. I'll say this over and over - he's only torn down to make Tigerheart look like Romeo, and although yes several other cats were done dirty like that too, Bumblestripe was the worst of them all since he was her direct competitor for Tigerheart. Wasn't asking it on Purdy's grave kind of strange, though? Yeah even if he didn't have ill intentions, doing it immediately after Purdy died (you know, someone loved and valued by the Clan) is gross. It comes across as a bit manipulative, even if it didn't mean it that way. Compare that with Tigerheart, who actually agreed with her that it was weird and makes an offhand comment about their age. Granted, I really don't think Bumblestripe intended to be insensitive and make her uncomfortable. He did apologise for it, but still.
|
|
#a3c5e6
Name Colour
𝓣𝓲𝓷𝓾𝓿𝓲𝓮𝓵
Warrior Fanatic
All hail me, the flower-flushing queen of Prague
|
Post by 𝓣𝓲𝓷𝓾𝓿𝓲𝓮𝓵 on Mar 12, 2024 17:07:25 GMT -5
Wasn't asking it on Purdy's grave kind of strange, though? Yeah even if he didn't have ill intentions, doing it immediately after Purdy died (you know, someone loved and valued by the Clan) is gross. It comes across as a bit manipulative, even if it didn't mean it that way. Compare that with Tigerheart, who actually agreed with her that it was weird and makes an offhand comment about their age. Granted, I really don't think Bumblestripe intended to be insensitive and make her uncomfortable. He did apologise for it, but still. The thing is, Bumblestripe actually didn't apologize, which makes it worse imo. He just drops it, but makes it clear he wants to continue the discussion later.
|
|
|
Post by Hollyfall on Mar 12, 2024 17:13:52 GMT -5
Yeah even if he didn't have ill intentions, doing it immediately after Purdy died (you know, someone loved and valued by the Clan) is gross. It comes across as a bit manipulative, even if it didn't mean it that way. Compare that with Tigerheart, who actually agreed with her that it was weird and makes an offhand comment about their age. Granted, I really don't think Bumblestripe intended to be insensitive and make her uncomfortable. He did apologise for it, but still. The thing is, Bumblestripe actually didn't apologize, which makes it worse imo. He just drops it, but makes it clear he wants to continue the discussion later. Oh damn, thanks for posting this. I had remembered it as him apologising after she told him off and maybe he realized it was insensitive, but clearly not. Yikers.
|
|
#a3c5e6
Name Colour
𝓣𝓲𝓷𝓾𝓿𝓲𝓮𝓵
Warrior Fanatic
All hail me, the flower-flushing queen of Prague
|
Post by 𝓣𝓲𝓷𝓾𝓿𝓲𝓮𝓵 on Mar 12, 2024 17:27:06 GMT -5
The thing is, Bumblestripe actually didn't apologize, which makes it worse imo. He just drops it, but makes it clear he wants to continue the discussion later. Oh damn, thanks for posting this. I had remembered it as him apologising after she told him off and maybe he realized it was insensitive, but clearly not. Yikers. Yeah, no problem! Do you think maybe you were confusing Bumblestripe with Finleap? Because for as awful as Finleap was, he actually does end up apologizing for trying to pressure kits onto Twigbranch. I can only recall Bumblestripe verbally apologizing to Dovewing one time, and that was for judging her during training in TLH.
|
|
Omnisexual
ᦓρ꠸ᥴꫀᠻꪖꪀᧁ
I need to finish An Isolated Clan ahhhhh
|
Post by ᦓρ꠸ᥴꫀᠻꪖꪀᧁ on Mar 12, 2024 17:40:50 GMT -5
Bumblestripe. The topic continues.
I’m a Bumblestripe defender. I posted about him on the “characters you love but a lot of people hate thread” a month or so ago. I got a lot of likes, so I guess some people agreed with me.
Bumblestripe is, well, how do I say this? A pawn in the story. Someone who moves the book forward. Someone to give Dovewing chapter content. He is terribly written and overly complicated and that’s why I like him. I personally think that the fandom took the fact that he is inconsistent and ran with it. No one fails to mention how terrible Bumblestripe was to Dovewing, yet many fail to mention the fact that he did care for Dovewing. Did he cross her boundaries? Yes, a few times. Does he do it as much as people say he does? Of course not. His fandom reaction is just a mini version of Brambleclaw’s. Did both Brambleclaw and Bumblestripe do bad things to their love interests? Yes. But they aren’t anywhere close to “abusive” and sometimes even calling them “toxic” is to much. They are both very seperate characters in very different situations so I’m not gonna get any farther into Brambleclaw than I’ve done here, but my point is sometimes the fandom overreacts.
The thing with Bumblestripe is that he maintains a consistent personality for maybe two books max. Bumblestripe in book abc is different then Bumblestripe in book xyz. He has a few traits that stay with him, but that’s it. And that’s why he’s hated so much, because a trait that stays with him is his pushy behavior. But he’s also very supportive at times and has more positive characteristics that I’m not going to list here because I don’t feel like writing a 500 word essay on why Bumblestripe isn’t too terrible. But I’d also like to mention that if you really pay attention as Tigerheart slowly starts to get worse Bumblestripe quickly gets worse. I know people are sick and tired of hearing that Bumblestripe was made bad to make Tigerheart look better, but honestly if you read into it, it’s the truth. That was Bumblestripe’s purpose. Make Tigerheart look like the better option. Does that defend his actions? No, it never will. Does it explain them? 100%
I’m not voting on this poll because there is no proper answer to this question. Bumblestripe did deserve hate, but he didn’t deserve as much.
|
|
|
Post by Sundance on Mar 12, 2024 23:24:45 GMT -5
All I know is that Bumblestripe must have wished that the Warriors series ended with The Last Hope when he and Dovewing were endgame. :-P I found this beautiful illustration of them by Puddleface on Warriors Amino. I share not necessarily because I'm a shipper but because it's just so beautiful.
|
|
|
Post by ✲ριкαƒυєу✲ on Mar 13, 2024 1:18:14 GMT -5
People keep saying he pushed her boundaries, but where exactly did that happen? Other than what he did during that extra scene about Purdy's death, I don't see where he did?
It's been a while since I've read OOTS
|
|
Bisexual
#FF00EC
Name Colour
BҽɾɾყႦʅσσɱ
Villain Enjoyer
Currently sick with the flu...
|
Post by BҽɾɾყႦʅσσɱ on Mar 13, 2024 5:58:24 GMT -5
While I do think Bumblestripe was written like that in order to make Tigerheart look better as Dovewing's other love interest, that doesn't mean it excuses Bumblestripe's invasive behaviour towards her in canon. He overstepped Dovewing's boundaries while she in turn should've been allowed to be written in a way that also communicated those boundaries better, in my opinion. Because it does feel like the writing intentionally made it so her rejection of him was always more vague when actually interacting with him. Plus, it doesn't exactly help that the rest of ThunderClan got portrayed to all be BumbleDove shippers for a while at one point lol.
I hate Tigerheart/star and still think he's a bad choice of mate for Dovewing. That being said, Bumblestripe also was not the right one either and I dislike him for being so very pushy towards Dovewing on occasion.
|
|
|
Post by Saint Ambrosef on Mar 13, 2024 12:06:07 GMT -5
Coming back to this.... a common complaint I see with Bumblestripe is the claim that talking about having kids after Purdy's death is wildly inappropriate, creepy, untimely, etc. That seems to be the main gripe people have with that scene.
I'm gonna be honest here and speak from my place as a married person who wants kids. This is not that weird. When you are in a committed relationship and desire kids someday, the death of someone close to you (and the subsequent realization of how short life is) can be a catalyst for re-examining the idea of starting a family with increased desire and greater urgency. There can also be emotional comfort provided by considering new life. I went through a quite similar situation earlier last year when my grandmother died; although my husband and I did want to have kids a little later, I suddenly felt emotionally compelled to re-think our plans and get started on that. (We ultimately decided to keep waiting, but it was an weighty conversation). Death is scary and a renewed interest in kids is a very real means of coping with grief.
Now, obviously not everyone reacts the same way, and Dovewing's aversion to the idea is totally legitimate, too. My point is moreso that Bumblestripe's suggestion is not objectively "insensitive" or "inappropriate". He's got a mate he loves, he wants kits with her someday, and tragedy has made him re-evaluate their timeline. I can relate to that a lot. Unfortunately they had polar-opposite emotional reactions in coping with the situation, which is why they both walk away feeling hurt/unheard by the other. But Bumblestripe is not actually that weird for merely suggesting the idea of kits at that moment. Again, it's actually a pretty normal way to cope with these things for someone in his position in life.
|
|
|
Post by Rainfire on Mar 13, 2024 12:48:38 GMT -5
Yup. I think the hate for him is completelyyyyyyy understandable
|
|
|
Post by ❅Maplefrost❅ on Mar 13, 2024 14:28:20 GMT -5
I don't think he really deserves to be like loathed and crucified. I think he genuinely loved Dovewing, asked an insensitive question at a bad time, and backed off when he was scolded about it. Nobody owes you a relationship of course, and I don't blame Dovewing for not returning feelings for him if she did not love him in the same way. What bothered me so much about Dovwing's part in all this was just how often she unfairly compared every single thing Bumblestripe did to Tigerheart. She constantly treated him like an afterthought even though she willingly entered a relationship with him. She was unkind and impatient no matter what Bumblestripe did, even if he didn't do anything wrong at all or just wanted to be active in their two-way relationship. I do feel bad that Bumblestripe was never told why he was dumped until Dovewing waltzed into camp with Tigerheart and their kits. And even then, Bumblestripe wished her the best and got over it, and now rightfully sees her as a Shadowclan cat, unwelcome in the Clan she left behind. I think at times the fandom will vilify him far too much while infantilizing Dovewing's clear lack of communication and constant unhealthy comparisons while she was actively in a relationship with Bumblestripe. As for the being written to cater to Tigerheart, that's literally every single cat in the series being written as at that point, so that's not my main concern at all. I just really hated how Dovewing treated Bumblestripe when they were mates. It was needlessly unkind. I don't think Dovewing should have been with anybody tbh. She would have been a much better character if she had stayed single. Pretty much this. Re-reading the books actually made me cringe every time Dovewing treated him like trash.
|
|
|
Post by Saint Ambrosef on Mar 13, 2024 15:36:26 GMT -5
I don't think he really deserves to be like loathed and crucified. I think he genuinely loved Dovewing, asked an insensitive question at a bad time, and backed off when he was scolded about it. Nobody owes you a relationship of course, and I don't blame Dovewing for not returning feelings for him if she did not love him in the same way. What bothered me so much about Dovwing's part in all this was just how often she unfairly compared every single thing Bumblestripe did to Tigerheart. She constantly treated him like an afterthought even though she willingly entered a relationship with him. She was unkind and impatient no matter what Bumblestripe did, even if he didn't do anything wrong at all or just wanted to be active in their two-way relationship. I do feel bad that Bumblestripe was never told why he was dumped until Dovewing waltzed into camp with Tigerheart and their kits. And even then, Bumblestripe wished her the best and got over it, and now rightfully sees her as a Shadowclan cat, unwelcome in the Clan she left behind. I think at times the fandom will vilify him far too much while infantilizing Dovewing's clear lack of communication and constant unhealthy comparisons while she was actively in a relationship with Bumblestripe. As for the being written to cater to Tigerheart, that's literally every single cat in the series being written as at that point, so that's not my main concern at all. I just really hated how Dovewing treated Bumblestripe when they were mates. It was needlessly unkind. I don't think Dovewing should have been with anybody tbh. She would have been a much better character if she had stayed single. Pretty much this. Re-reading the books actually made me cringe every time Dovewing treated him like trash. I would add that while I think Dovewing's aversion to thinking about kits in that moment is understandable, I do think the way she responded to Bumblestripe was way out of line. I get she was stressed out, but she basically called her mate an idiot and told him to shut up. People talk about how Bumble should have apologized for bringing up the subject, but Dovewing definitely owed him an apology for reacting the way she did. His calm response is kinda amenable given how she just went off.
|
|
#a3c5e6
Name Colour
𝓣𝓲𝓷𝓾𝓿𝓲𝓮𝓵
Warrior Fanatic
All hail me, the flower-flushing queen of Prague
|
Post by 𝓣𝓲𝓷𝓾𝓿𝓲𝓮𝓵 on Mar 13, 2024 15:52:05 GMT -5
He's got a mate he loves, he wants kits with her someday, and tragedy has made him re-evaluate their timeline. You're actually not that far off about his reasoning. In fact, he even says as much himself when he brings it up. However, a point about this part here, Bumblestripe and Dovewing weren't mates at the time. They'd been broken up for about two years by the time the scene takes place. At least for me, it's less about him bringing up the topic during a crucial moment (it wasn't just Purdy's death, but Darktail was still at large as well), and more to do with the fact that he basically asked his former mate to have babies with him and then just told her to think about it after she protested.
|
|
|
Post by Saint Ambrosef on Mar 13, 2024 18:06:29 GMT -5
He's got a mate he loves, he wants kits with her someday, and tragedy has made him re-evaluate their timeline. You're actually not that far off about his reasoning. In fact, he even says as much himself when he brings it up. However, a point about this part here, Bumblestripe and Dovewing weren't mates at the time. They'd been broken up for about two years by the time the scene takes place. At least for me, it's less about him bringing up the topic during a crucial moment (it wasn't just Purdy's death, but Darktail was still at large as well), and more to do with the fact that he basically asked his former mate to have babies with him and then just told her to think about it after she protested. Oh that does change things then. I haven't read that book in years so I forgot they were broken up. I still sympathize with his reasoning, but it is odd to ask your ex that out of the blue.
|
|
|
Post by ❅Maplefrost❅ on Mar 14, 2024 0:50:57 GMT -5
You're actually not that far off about his reasoning. In fact, he even says as much himself when he brings it up. However, a point about this part here, Bumblestripe and Dovewing weren't mates at the time. They'd been broken up for about two years by the time the scene takes place. At least for me, it's less about him bringing up the topic during a crucial moment (it wasn't just Purdy's death, but Darktail was still at large as well), and more to do with the fact that he basically asked his former mate to have babies with him and then just told her to think about it after she protested. Oh that does change things then. I haven't read that book in years so I forgot they were broken up. I still sympathize with his reasoning, but it is odd to ask your ex that out of the blue. I do want to say some things (not directed at you though, just in general). There's still other instances, even before they were a thing, while he was simply just trying to help her out with training, she had a habit of snapping at him. She would constantly, and I mean constantly, compare him to Tigerheart, if I had a nickel for every time that happened I'd be rich. Her treating him terribly just because she knew he liked her was weird. Not saying she had to return his feelings, but it's weird to verbally berate someone just because you find out they liked you, even though they never even confessed to you at that time. Like he was just being a clanmate at the time, as a clanmate should, and when she found out he liked her, then she started treating him horribly. Hence why when she gets chewed out by Rosepetal (deserved), and then goes to apologize to him, he basically says he gets it, she doesn't like him and basically says he gets the message, but was upset with how she was treating him, not knowing she was that type of cat personality wise. She was basically using him like a scratching post, to vent her frustrations out on, even before he ever told her about his feelings. Also the fact she gets with him, not because she has feelings for him, but because he was convenient. He was a ThunderClan cat, so that made things easier for her, essentially using him to try and get over Tigerheart. And ironically, Bumblestripe never knew there was another cat in the scenario of their relationship (a lot of members in ThunderClan didn't know actually), for the longest time. Not before they got together, not while they were together, and not even after they broke up, and he thought it was just a rough patch. She herself admits internally (even before the passing of Purdy) that they could have been a thing, thinks about it for a moment, but remembers she doesn't have feelings for him. He's not Tigerheart. There's also the misconception that Bumblestripe was pushy about kits, he only asked once, the first time he even talks about kits was because he said he thinks she'd be a wonderful mother. She didn't mind the idea of kits, just not with him. The fact that she gets snappy with him when he tries to help her after she loses her powers, the times when she's cold to him whle he's trying to support her, etc. I can go on about how one-sided this relationship was. The ending was the icing on the cake, because she literally blindsides her (and the rest of the clan) by showing up with another guy's kits. Keep in mind, he never knew about her and Tiger being a thing prior to that, so now seeing this, it makes him questions everything that ever goes on between them. Hence why he changes personality wise after AVoS. It's not because jealous, he just starts to detach himself from anything after that. He starts to focus more on being a better warrior, and obviously hardened his feelings. Was he perfect? No. But I'll be honest, he only overstepped like one time? And prior to that he was just fine, compared to Tigerheart (ironically) who overstepped many many times. But people overlook him and vilify Bumblestripe a lot when it comes to the three of them. Treating him like Ashfur 2.0, when in reality he was basically just a normal dude. With how things are going with Bumblestripe, I don't think he'll ever trust another relationship ever again, or at least not for quite a while. Hence why I suspect he probably rejected Rosepetal, which is why she could relate to Bristlefrost's feelings over Stemleaf.
|
|
|
Post by Sphinxwhisker on Mar 14, 2024 2:41:41 GMT -5
Well looks like this topic is running its course again. And plenty of people have weighed in. Guess I’ll chime in with my 2 cents. Firstly, No. he wasn’t deserving of any of the hostile mistreatment Dovewing gave him. The infamous scene that tarnished his reputation has been grossly warped by the fandom, and is used to interpret him as some creepy ex that asked for children out of the blue. When, imho, it’s made rather abundantly clear it’s been a topic of discussion for them recently, that hasn’t come to a definitive conclusion yet.
And I’m really confused with the argument that Dovewing was pressured into a relationship with Bumblestripe, or that he crossed boundaries? When Dovewing never actually established any. And the only cat that was a constant denominator of pressure would have been Ivypool, being she was the only cat privy to Dovewing’s illicit affair with Tigerheart. Cinderheart’s was a one-time interjection likely spurned by her perceived doomed romance with Lionblaze, and was likely trying to protect Dovewing from suffering the same as her in some way. Whitewing’s comment is also viewed as problematic by some, with some people thinking Bumblestripe set her up to it, and I honestly don’t see any reasonable rationale for that conclusion. Probably more than likely she noticed Bumblestripe becoming fond of her daughter, and decided to casually make Dovewing aware while subtly giving approval. Rosepetal scolding Dovewing could hardly imo be construed as her pushing her into liking Bumblestripe, moreover that him liking her doesn’t justify her treating him poorly, and if she doesn’t return his feelings, should be able to handle the situation like a civilized adult.
Which is ultimately the culprit of practically everything in their tumultuous relationship, being her lack of communication. if she wasn’t interested she could have simply been straightforward from the start. Instead of biting his head off everytime he attempted to spend extra time, or give special affection to her, or any other typical behavior someone exhibits when trying to court a potential suitor. Than turning around apologizing and making her outburst to be because of stress or other, and not her disinterest.
And I don’t know where people get calling him pushy really. Throughout all of OoTS he does nothing more than try to spend more time with her and subtly express his feelings through compliments and other gestures. He never tries to force/control her into any relationship with him. And heck even takes the hint she doesn’t like him back after being chewed out in TLH, and proclaims he’s throwing in the towel, however much it pains him. Leaving the ball for any romantic relationship entirely in Dovewing’s court. It easily could have ended there if Dovewing truly desired such. And honestly I think if she felt nothing towards him, she’d have let it die there, instead of deciding to pursue a relationship with him later on.
And I know some think she only got together with him purely out of convenience, I disagree. Because the fact that she constantly makes comparisons between Bumblestripe and Tigerheart(which I do agree was unfair) is indicative she viewed him as a strong, potential suitor. Otherwise there’d be no need to make comparisons, and for her to weigh out her options. Him bringing up them having kits together at a funeral is admittedly very untimely, but again, it’s made very telling that it’s a open discussion they’ve weighed on recently, and wasn’t unexpected to Dovewing, and Bumblestripe was fervently hoping for a positive outcome. He’s not just unwittingly out of the blue proposing that he and his ex who’ve been split for awhile to try to make it work and start a family. It’s clearly been spoken about already.
Ultimately I don’t see him as creepy. And imo he’s undeserving of all the demonizing the fandom throughs his way. Frankly, he unfortunately fell for a cat that was a overwhelmed wreck, whom couldn’t make a decisive decision on her feelings, and instead gave mixed signals, and precarious impressions that she genuinely liked him back, and he decided to leap into the relationship with full gusto. Only to be stonewalled down the road for no apparent reason, than to be given false hope of reconciliation of their relationship, than ultimately being rejected, and discovering you were competing with someone else the whole time, and everything was a lie from the beginning.
Anyways, that just my 2 cents on the matter.
|
|