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Post by Deleted on Oct 30, 2023 19:26:45 GMT -5
I get how she has been very stubborn to say the least… but I honestly like her and wouldn’t mind seeing what the future has in store your my bushy-tailed cutie don't get me wrong, she's a fine character, it's just the canon hasn't made her... grow up? she's unbearably childish at points and despite me being a loser for the couple in scenes like ALITM where they reunite after being apart for so long, or scenes like in SqH at the end where he's begging for her to come back to him, her notion of "squilf's way or the highway" is so awful. she needs to understand balance in leadership, emotions, and politics, and i feel like that's what she doesn't do.
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Post by stupidflower on Oct 30, 2023 19:30:43 GMT -5
Unpopular opinion here, but I like both Squirrelflight and Bramblestar. I used to dislike Squirrelflight, but now I appreciate how she isn't perfect, and her inability to believe herself to be wrong makes her super interesting to me. I have disliked her many times. I disliked how she was angry that Lionblaze and Jayfeather were angry at Leafpool. I disliked how much she was willing to sacrifice to get Bramblestar back, and how many LIVES she was willing to sacrifice. I didn't like how she belitled Brambleclaw during the Hawkfrost situation, when what he needed was support and reassurance. Her actions in SqH actually didn't bother me too much though. She felt Firestar-esque (though admitedly with more potential to be more destructive) in violating the rules to do what she felt was right, no matter the risk. Firestar did similar, though Squilf was that times 100. We obviously expect more of her because of her position and how old she is. But that isn't who she is. She's headstrong and overconfident and dense and I like that she's a more unique character in that way. She makes mistakes. She isn't perfect. She's not the brightest. She was reckless and stupid and thought with her heart over her head and could have caused tons of problems. And that's what I like about her. It makes her interesting and I can't bring myself to dislike her anymore. The Squirrelstar reign will be undoubtedly interesting and full of chaos: just how I like it. And at this point, it feels like snatching leadership away, no matter how short, when she is so close would have been cruel to her after everything she's suffered, and yes, she HAS suffered. I feel that we forget how traumatized and damaged she is, less so than Bramble, but still very much so. Has she wronged others? Has she messed up? Was she downright unbareable at times? Yes. But if someone like Blackstar gets to be leader, I personally think Squirrelflight should get a chance, even a small one.
Her reign will definitely be short due to her age and obvious incoming Ivystar, but I think it will be very interesting and I'm glad it's happening. Not a Squilf defender in the slightest, lol. Just wanted to share my own thoughts. It's cool to get a flawed, but not utterly awful (imo) character (ex. awful like Leopardstar, Onestar) in a position of power right now, and I'm excited for it. This will definitely be an unpopular opinion on here, I don't want anyone to think less of me haha. i don't understand why she's so completely apathetic to her mate's dissonance, it feels so wrong, that's what's been hurting me- that and the whole squilf's hope stuff where he basically realizes she's hurting him but consistently undermining him. Agreed completely on how she's dismissed his issues. Honestly, that made her even more interesting as a character to me. How she's likely so traumatized from the events, from what Ashfur did, from what he did to Bramblesar, that now she's kind of... almost checked out. It's like she's trying to forget it ever happened, while her mate CAN'T forget. She is trying desperately to go back to normalcy, and she's hurting her mate in the process. It's so interesting that after everything that happened last arc, they can just go back to fighting as if none of that even mattered. It's a strange little way of showing how the trauma has affected her, because, at least to me, she never seemed so unempathetic before TBC. Not to excuse how indifferent she's been. I don't like her actions AT ALL. But it makes her so much more interesting to me. She's not my favorite, no where near, actually. I'm honestly more neutral, now that I think about it. My opinion actually fluctuates a lot, I'm interested to see how it changes. I went from mildly disliking her, to liking her, to disliking her again, to liking her again, to HEAVILY disliking her in TBC, to now appreciating how interesting she is. Guess we'll see how this goes. Editing to add that I just realized I like her a lot again. My opinion really does change quickly lol
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Post by Deleted on Oct 30, 2023 19:33:29 GMT -5
Her actions in SqH actually didn't bother me too much though. She felt Firestar-esque (though admitedly with more potential to be more destructive) in violating the rules to do what she felt was right, no matter the risk. Firestar did similar, though Squilf was that times 100. I've always said that Squirrelflight has Firestar's moral compass but combined with Sandstorm's righteous pride, so the result is a very headstrong character, lol. you said this on the squirrelflight's behavior post and i rmbr you said something like "she inherited her father's sense of nobility with her mother's unrelenting pride, which is a bad combo" and that stuck with me for so long because that's just it. she didn't have her issues curbed, therefore she became like the stubborn and more blindsided firestar + sandstorm mix. it's a bad mix, and her childish actions at some points really ties into making her a lacking character in certain aspects and just a bad choice for leader.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 30, 2023 19:35:25 GMT -5
i don't understand why she's so completely apathetic to her mate's dissonance, it feels so wrong, that's what's been hurting me- that and the whole squilf's hope stuff where he basically realizes she's hurting him but consistently undermining him. Agreed completely on how she's dismissed his issues. Honestly, that made her even more interesting as a character to me. How she's likely so traumatized from the events, from what Ashfur did, from what he did to Bramblesar, that now she's kind of... almost checked out. It's like she's trying to forget it ever happened, while her mate CAN'T forget. She is trying desperately to go back to normalcy, and she's hurting her mate in the process. It's so interesting that after everything that happened last arc, they can just go back to fighting as if none of that even mattered. It's a strange little way of showing how the trauma has affected her, because, at least to me, she never seemed so unempathetic before TBC. Not to excuse how indifferent she's been. I don't like her actions AT ALL. But it makes her so much more interesting to me. She's not my favorite, no where near, actually. I'm honestly more neutral, now that I think about it. My opinion actually fluctuates a lot, I'm interested to see how it changes. I went from mildly disliking her, to liking her, to disliking her again, to liking her again, to HEAVILY disliking her in TBC, to now appreciating how interesting she is. Guess we'll see how this goes. agreed here! i'd like to see her become the stark opposite of her father, even if it's for a short period of time.
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Post by Slightdapple on Oct 30, 2023 20:09:31 GMT -5
I really don't like Squirrelflight. Really hoping for Ivystar instead.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 30, 2023 20:15:04 GMT -5
I really don't like Squirrelflight. Really hoping for Ivystar instead. agreed lol
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Post by کیوان on Oct 30, 2023 20:53:22 GMT -5
Interesting story. I actually had the opportunity to speak with Blixemi at one point, and I told her that I low-key liked Bramblestar. And you know what? She was chill with it! That moment instantly solidified who my favorite WC Youtuber is.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 30, 2023 21:28:43 GMT -5
Interesting story. I actually had the opportunity to speak with Blixemi at one point, and I told her that I low-key liked Bramblestar. And you know what? She was chill with it! That moment instantly solidified who my favorite WC Youtuber is. what a sweetheart! I'm glad she was cool w it! I've had the unfortunate run-in's with some warrior cat YouTubers who I'll keep unnamed who've been awful bc i like bramble- very upsetting but what can you do! what did she say when you told her !!
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Post by ! (Ġray) ! on Oct 30, 2023 21:30:48 GMT -5
Interesting story. I actually had the opportunity to speak with Blixemi at one point, and I told her that I low-key liked Bramblestar. And you know what? She was chill with it! That moment instantly solidified who my favorite WC Youtuber is. what a sweetheart! I'm glad she was cool w it! I've had the unfortunate run-in's with some warrior cat YouTubers who I'll keep unnamed who've been awful bc i like bramble- very upsetting but what can you do! what did she say when you told her !! I have a suspicion I know what youtubers your talking about... Imagine being a grown adult and being awful to a teenager because they have opinions about a cat that doesn't exist that differ from yours
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Post by Deleted on Oct 30, 2023 21:35:43 GMT -5
what a sweetheart! I'm glad she was cool w it! I've had the unfortunate run-in's with some warrior cat YouTubers who I'll keep unnamed who've been awful bc i like bramble- very upsetting but what can you do! what did she say when you told her !! I have a suspicion I know what youtubers your talking about... Imagine being a grown adult and being awful to a teenager because they have opinions about a cat that doesn't exist that differ from yours I'll give you a hint... they were in my doc... lol >-< but yep... that youtuber is awful, hard to deal with their fans who bombard me on the daily on tumblr and tiktok calling me awful things for explaining how misunderstood a fake cat is. that same youtuber also is disgustingly condescending in their replies to one of my friends on youtube, made me lose a lot of respect for them.
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Post by ! (Ġray) ! on Oct 30, 2023 21:40:48 GMT -5
You're so real for making this document also what's your tumblr i'll follow you @silverpaws
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Post by Deleted on Oct 30, 2023 21:44:57 GMT -5
sadly ended up deleting tumblr bc i was afraid of being attacked more than i already was! </3 but I'm mainly on tiktok with the same user, @.silverpaw ! (Ġray) !
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Post by کیوان on Oct 30, 2023 21:49:27 GMT -5
Interesting story. I actually had the opportunity to speak with Blixemi at one point, and I told her that I low-key liked Bramblestar. And you know what? She was chill with it! That moment instantly solidified who my favorite WC Youtuber is. what a sweetheart! I'm glad she was cool w it! I've had the unfortunate run-in's with some warrior cat YouTubers who I'll keep unnamed who've been awful bc i like bramble- very upsetting but what can you do! what did she say when you told her !! I asked for her opinion on Bramble (It was more than a year ago, but I think she said something about how he was fun when he was young, but kind of faded into the background over time), but other than that, we respected each others' opinions and had a nice chat, and that was more than enough for me.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 30, 2023 21:51:29 GMT -5
what a sweetheart! I'm glad she was cool w it! I've had the unfortunate run-in's with some warrior cat YouTubers who I'll keep unnamed who've been awful bc i like bramble- very upsetting but what can you do! what did she say when you told her !! I asked for her opinion on Bramble (It was more than a year ago, but I think she said something about how he was fun when he was young, but kind of faded into the background over time), but other than that, we respected each others' opinions and had a nice chat, and that was more than enough for me. this made me smile, I'm so glad she was so respectful!!! wish others were like this TT
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Post by ! (Ġray) ! on Oct 30, 2023 21:54:21 GMT -5
um. Just read the part of the doc where you debunked moons quotes and the fact that "the reader knows Hawkfrost is evil therefore that is enough proof that Squirrelpaw knows he is evil and Brambleclaw is being a bad person" is not proof. Squirrelpaw is not reading the books. Neither is Brambleclaw. They don't know for a fact that Hawkfrost is evil
Also nobody tries to understand Brambleclaws point of view. He has nobody. He doesn't have any family: Tawnypelt is in another clan, his father (who has been shown to be decent towards Brambleclaw and Tawnypelt in tpb) is dead and the entirity of the clans hate him, so he can't even talk to anyone about whatever grief he has because everyone would say "he's evil so you shouldn't care". And along comes Hawkfrost, and Brambleclaw finally gets another family member to bond with, and he has so much patience for Hawkfrost and Tigerstar because he desperately wants a family. And nobody even acknowledges it. Like seriously warrior cats readers, if you're going to pour all of your soul into hating a fictional cat, at least do your research
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Post by Deleted on Oct 30, 2023 22:09:12 GMT -5
um. Just read the part of the doc where you debunked moons quotes and the fact that "the reader knows Hawkfrost is evil therefore that is enough proof that Squirrelpaw knows he is evil and Brambleclaw is being a bad person" is not proof. Squirrelpaw is not reading the books. Neither is Brambleclaw. They don't know for a fact that Hawkfrost is evil Also nobody tries to understand Brambleclaws point of view. He has nobody. He doesn't have any family: Tawnypelt is in another clan, his father (who has been shown to be decent towards Brambleclaw and Tawnypelt in tpb) is dead and the entirity of the clans hate him, so he can't even talk to anyone about whatever grief he has because everyone would say "he's evil so you shouldn't care". And along comes Hawkfrost, and Brambleclaw finally gets another family member to bond with, and he has so much patience for Hawkfrost and Tigerstar because he desperately wants a family. And nobody even acknowledges it. Like seriously warrior cats readers, if you're going to pour all of your soul into hating a fictional cat, at least do your research i swear, that certain youtuber has NEVER heard of dramatic irony- aka where the readers know something the characters don't. like, to a traumatized, lonely, and depressed child, seeing someone who is very similar to you and understands your prejudice causes you to ignore red flags. and when a cat you're best friends with starts to hate on the cat you're related to for no reason besides "oh, my SISTER said so" then ofc you'll be hesitant to start hating on them. and yes, this exactly. it's like people go OUT OF THEIR WAY to find reasons to hate him. he points out how squilf was becoming oddly submissive and out of character with ashfur? he's patronizing and abusive. he snaps at squilf n ashfur for not doing their work? he's an abuser and a jerk. he gets upset that his efforts to help his clan rebuild aren't recognized with an apprentice? he's an abuser and an ahole for not just dealing with it. such small things which would usually get brushed over with any other character are now hyperfocused on with him, insane.
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Aroace
#ffa100
Name Colour
𝕱𝖑𝖚𝖙𝖙𝖊𝖗𝖋𝖆𝖑𝖑
Villain Enjoyer
Taking a break from the forums because my cat died. Will probably be back mid to late October.
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Post by 𝕱𝖑𝖚𝖙𝖙𝖊𝖗𝖋𝖆𝖑𝖑 on Oct 31, 2023 5:09:27 GMT -5
The tumblr side of our fandom sure will hate this thread...
But anyway, I still love BrambleSquirrel as characters (never as a ship though) but can understand why they get criticized and are considered controversial on either/both side(s). Neither of them is perfect and nor do they need to be, flaws are fun usually.
Not sure I agree with the sentiment that Squirrelflight has changed as a character though. She's always been headstrong/stubborn, bossy, impulsive and passionate in her beliefs. That is why I still love her even if I'm not always in agreement with how she (or Bramblestar) handle certain matters.
Do hope that they'll be retired from the spotlight of this series soon though. Because other cats, old and new, deserve more attention in the story as well.
Also, I know about the Thunder spoilers but just wanted to keep my post free of them for now on here.
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Post by 𓆩♡𓆪Moonshine𓆩♡𓆪 on Oct 31, 2023 5:15:41 GMT -5
um. Just read the part of the doc where you debunked moons quotes and the fact that "the reader knows Hawkfrost is evil therefore that is enough proof that Squirrelpaw knows he is evil and Brambleclaw is being a bad person" is not proof. Squirrelpaw is not reading the books. Neither is Brambleclaw. They don't know for a fact that Hawkfrost is evil I saw red when I read that. "We know he's evil so Squirrelpaw is right! Brambleclaw bad! " Just because we the reader see Tallstar make Onewhisker deputy doesn't mean anyone else from the clans did. Mudclaw gets rightfully suspicious then. The problem with that video is a lack of perspective. It's always about Squirrelflight's side and never once tries to tell it from Bramblestar's POV. Went back to that video to see a huge comment refuting said video's point and they immediately got pounced on and told that their mini essay was full of misinformation.
"Squirrelflight had proof Hawkfrost was evil because Leafpool had a vision about Hawk and Bramble in the DF and told her!" when this literally is not what happened.
I swear these people don't even read the books.
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Post by Katanaheart on Oct 31, 2023 5:55:24 GMT -5
I can’t find this document but so badly desire to read it. But to the point of this post as I wanted to bring up a few scenes in SQH and a repeated pattern in ASC.
To the pattern point as it was mentioned already, Squirrelflight using her relationship as a mother and deputy against Sparkpelt to then be used against Bramblestar. She does this twice, once being in SQH and then again when confronting WindClan about the prey issue. She brings Sparkpelt on that patrol which shows she still holds a grip over her daughter and isn’t going to blink against using her to further her own goals when Squirrelflight is going against Bramblestar’s words and desires.
Meadowkit and Gladekit, these are the names Squirrelflight considered for her own grandchildren as Sparkpelt had refused to name them. (Also did anyone else get weird almost fetish like vibes from Squirrelflight in SQH during that scene where she considers Sparkpelt just not getting better? (I wish I had the book on me since it’s been a while since I read SQH.)
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Post by moongloweevee on Oct 31, 2023 7:06:58 GMT -5
I can’t find this document but so badly desire to read it. But to the point of this post as I wanted to bring up a few scenes in SQH and a repeated pattern in ASC. To the pattern point as it was mentioned already, Squirrelflight using her relationship as a mother and deputy against Sparkpelt to then be used against Bramblestar. She does this twice, once being in SQH and then again when confronting WindClan about the prey issue. She brings Sparkpelt on that patrol which shows she still holds a grip over her daughter and isn’t going to blink against using her to further her own goals when Squirrelflight is going against Bramblestar’s words and desires. Meadowkit and Gladekit, these are the names Squirrelflight considered for her own grandchildren as Sparkpelt had refused to name them. (Also did anyone else get weird almost fetish like vibes from Squirrelflight in SQH during that scene where she considers Sparkpelt just not getting better? (I wish I had the book on me since it’s been a while since I read SQH.) Hello, I sent you a dm containing the doc so you may read it. I fully believe that Squirrelflight was going through a midlife crisis in her super edition since a lot of the time, she was crying over wanting or thinking about kits.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 31, 2023 10:46:47 GMT -5
The tumblr side of our fandom sure will hate this thread... But anyway, I still love BrambleSquirrel as characters (never as a ship though) but can understand why they get criticized and are considered controversial on either/both side(s). Neither of them is perfect and nor do they need to be, flaws are fun usually. Not sure I agree with the sentiment that Squirrelflight has changed as a character though. She's always been headstrong/stubborn, bossy, impulsive and passionate in her beliefs. That is why I still love her even if I'm not always in agreement with how she (or Bramblestar) handle certain matters. Do hope that they'll be retired from the spotlight of this series soon though. Because other cats, old and new, deserve more attention in the story as well. Also, I know about the Thunder spoilers but just wanted to keep my post free of them for now on here. i loved squilf so much i just can’t stand her in the current arc. her in TBC was so tragic and i loved it, but seeing her so apathetic now feels so OOC?
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Post by Deleted on Oct 31, 2023 10:47:22 GMT -5
I can’t find this document but so badly desire to read it. But to the point of this post as I wanted to bring up a few scenes in SQH and a repeated pattern in ASC. To the pattern point as it was mentioned already, Squirrelflight using her relationship as a mother and deputy against Sparkpelt to then be used against Bramblestar. She does this twice, once being in SQH and then again when confronting WindClan about the prey issue. She brings Sparkpelt on that patrol which shows she still holds a grip over her daughter and isn’t going to blink against using her to further her own goals when Squirrelflight is going against Bramblestar’s words and desires. Meadowkit and Gladekit, these are the names Squirrelflight considered for her own grandchildren as Sparkpelt had refused to name them. (Also did anyone else get weird almost fetish like vibes from Squirrelflight in SQH during that scene where she considers Sparkpelt just not getting better? (I wish I had the book on me since it’s been a while since I read SQH.) were you able to get it?? it’s hyperlinked on my page if not! and yes, the whole ignoring sparkpelt’s grief was disgusting.
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Asexual
#A3E4D7
Name Colour
🍄🎶✨Brambleheart✨🎶🍄
rdj as doctor doom was not on my bingo card
Pronouns: She/her, they/them
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Post by 🍄🎶✨Brambleheart✨🎶🍄 on Oct 31, 2023 11:08:33 GMT -5
manifesting a freaky friday plot just for the meme potential
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Post by Katanaheart on Oct 31, 2023 12:16:36 GMT -5
I can’t find this document but so badly desire to read it. But to the point of this post as I wanted to bring up a few scenes in SQH and a repeated pattern in ASC. To the pattern point as it was mentioned already, Squirrelflight using her relationship as a mother and deputy against Sparkpelt to then be used against Bramblestar. She does this twice, once being in SQH and then again when confronting WindClan about the prey issue. She brings Sparkpelt on that patrol which shows she still holds a grip over her daughter and isn’t going to blink against using her to further her own goals when Squirrelflight is going against Bramblestar’s words and desires. Meadowkit and Gladekit, these are the names Squirrelflight considered for her own grandchildren as Sparkpelt had refused to name them. (Also did anyone else get weird almost fetish like vibes from Squirrelflight in SQH during that scene where she considers Sparkpelt just not getting better? (I wish I had the book on me since it’s been a while since I read SQH.) were you able to get it?? it’s hyperlinked on my page if not! and yes, the whole ignoring sparkpelt’s grief was disgusting. I was dmed a link to it!
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Post by Deleted on Oct 31, 2023 14:09:03 GMT -5
were you able to get it?? it’s hyperlinked on my page if not! and yes, the whole ignoring sparkpelt’s grief was disgusting. I was dmed a link to it! perfect!! lmk ur thoughts
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Post by Deleted on Oct 31, 2023 14:13:47 GMT -5
manifesting a freaky friday plot just for the meme potential omg that’s so silly n real tbh
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Post by vectoring34 on Oct 31, 2023 14:17:38 GMT -5
She didn't threaten to harm him. She got mad and growled, but didn't so much as lift a paw or make any sign that she would. What is actually being said there is that she looked very angry. But looking angry is a very far cry from threatening anything.
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Post by User33 on Oct 31, 2023 15:16:10 GMT -5
Thanks for making this thread! My opinions on both Squirrleflight and Bramblestar have definitely changed now. I feel bad for Bramblestar now
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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2023 0:33:32 GMT -5
She didn't threaten to harm him. She got mad and growled, but didn't so much as lift a paw or make any sign that she would. What is actually being said there is that she looked very angry. But looking angry is a very far cry from threatening anything. i agree, she didn’t actually harm him or threaten, i only wanted to point that out as it feels so awful to read any type of physical abuse, even if there was no action that followed.
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Post by moongloweevee on Nov 2, 2023 12:08:47 GMT -5
She didn't threaten to harm him. She got mad and growled, but didn't so much as lift a paw or make any sign that she would. What is actually being said there is that she looked very angry. But looking angry is a very far cry from threatening anything. If the roles were reversed and this was Brambleclaw to Squilf (as leader), would you still feel the same about the scenario? Would you be condeming Bramble for getting angry at his leader and ready to swipe at her? If so, why should the slight threat of being physically violent only apply to Bramble and not Squilf?
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