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Post by ᏞᎪᎠᎽ Ꮎf fᎪᏁᎠᎾms ミ☆ on Aug 2, 2021 17:21:27 GMT -5
flamepaw's story based on the summary for ASC sounds so wasteful, lame, and unnecessary. there's already been tons of plots about worrying about the legacy or sins of ur kin (mainly brambleclaw, tigerheart, etc.). firekin getting focus again only makes me more anti-firekin and anti-thunderclan.
his story sounds the least important and the least interesting.
A Starless Clan is going in the right direction by including a riverclan POV and a shadowclan POV that isn't related to tigerstar/tawnypelt, but still...why even include flamepaw at all? an unecessary and useless thunderclan POV? a repeat of AVOS with alderheart being irrelevant? no thanks.
flamepaw's POV Slot should have been giviven to a non-crowfeather related cat in windclan instead...one of those apprentices, flutter, song, or whistle, or my personal fave pick of hootwhisker and slightfoot...
but no. we can't have an arc without a thunderclan POV. it's bad enough that AVOS was awful because of the lack of windclan POV (bc windclan was where the plot SHOULD have focused on due to darktail's story, but NOPE! we had useless alderheart POV even though he ceased being relevant after a the first book).
but A Starless Clan is once again shoving thunderclan in our faces, and with a lame and recycled plotline too...
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Post by Ṣanɗypaw™ on Aug 2, 2021 17:26:09 GMT -5
I really hope that the Erins manage to make Flamepaw's personality more unique- as in, worrying about his legacy in a "different" way? Since this plotline is going to happen, I can only hope that Flamepaw's story will be different. But yeah, I also wish that ThunderClan's POV could have been swapped out for a WindClan POV or something. They've had a narrator for every arc, it's time to take a little break from ThunderClan.
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Post by Chicken on Aug 2, 2021 17:30:39 GMT -5
I agree with most of your post, but Alderheart was a lot more relevant in AVOS than he's given credit for, like he discovered a new cure to save Puddleshine's life using deathberries, but for the most part, you're right, and I think his POV would have been WAY better in TBC over Bristlefrost, and Sunbeam would have been better for it than Shadowsight, because Ashfur talking to Alderheart would have made way more sense than some random ShadowClan cat. Back to the main point, I'm disappointed about what Flamepaw's arc might be too, oh his name is Flamepaw, and that's close to fire, so he has to live up to Firestar's legacy, or something, I haven't really seen anything that would tell me otherwise, why he would be worried about it, and other cats like Sparkpelt, Hollytuft, Snaptooth, etc wouldn't be. However, maybe his POV will give us a chance to learn more about his personality, and the personalities about the other cats in ThunderClan outside of just a small circle, but I highly doubt it. One thing I am disappointed about though, is that it's yet ANOTHER tom POV with one sister, this is the third time in a row. I honestly wish Flickerkit would have lived over Flame or Finch because his prefix is unique, and he is a tortie which a tortie POV in the main series would be new. I'm really interested in seeing where this arc goes, but I don't have much high hopes for it. Maybe WindClan will get their time to shine in the next arc or so.
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Post by ᏞᎪᎠᎽ Ꮎf fᎪᏁᎠᎾms ミ☆ on Aug 2, 2021 17:40:32 GMT -5
I really hope that the Erins manage to make Flamepaw's personality more unique- as in, worrying about his legacy in a "different" way? Since this plotline is going to happen, I can only hope that Flamepaw's story will be different. But yeah, I also wish that ThunderClan's POV could have been swapped out for a WindClan POV or something. They've had a narrator for every arc, it's time to take a little break from ThunderClan. i cant think of a way they could make flamepaw or his story unique...from the summary, it just sounds boring and there's nothing they can really add to make it something we havent seen before.
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Post by ᏞᎪᎠᎽ Ꮎf fᎪᏁᎠᎾms ミ☆ on Aug 2, 2021 17:41:46 GMT -5
I agree with most of your post, but Alderheart was a lot more relevant in AVOS than he's given credit for, like he discovered a new cure to save Puddleshine's life using deathberries, but for the most part, you're right, and I think his POV would have been WAY better in TBC over Bristlefrost, and Sunbeam would have been better for it than Shadowsight, because Ashfur talking to Alderheart would have made way more sense than some random ShadowClan cat. Back to the main point, I'm disappointed about what Flamepaw's arc might be too, oh his name is Flamepaw, and that's close to fire, so he has to live up to Firestar's legacy, or something, I haven't really seen anything that would tell me otherwise, why he would be worried about it, and other cats like Sparkpelt, Hollytuft, Snaptooth, etc wouldn't be. However, maybe his POV will give us a chance to learn more about his personality, and the personalities about the other cats in ThunderClan outside of just a small circle, but I highly doubt it. One thing I am disappointed about though, is that it's yet ANOTHER tom POV with one sister, this is the third time in a row. I honestly wish Flickerkit would have lived over Flame or Finch because his prefix is unique, and he is a tortie which a tortie POV in the main series would be new. I'm really interested in seeing where this arc goes, but I don't have much high hopes for it. Maybe WindClan will get their time to shine in the next arc or so. sparkpelt was said to look similar to firestar, and she never had to deal with this legacy issue...and yeah i know people will already say "well people handle issues differently" and i get that, but...why flamepaw specifically? why would the writers chose this plot for firekin all these years later? it makes no sense and it just sounds boring. we've been through similar plots like that before...
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Post by Skypaw13 on Aug 2, 2021 17:44:08 GMT -5
You should at least give it a chance first. You have literally no idea what direction they're going to take it beyond "he has some hang-ups about his family legacy". Remember that all three of these cats are protagonists in the same arc, their plots are going to converge into the same story at some point. It's not like Flamepaw's going to be sitting around moping about not being Firestar while the other two are off fighting demons. All three will have moments of boredom and moments of interest.
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Post by ᏞᎪᎠᎽ Ꮎf fᎪᏁᎠᎾms ミ☆ on Aug 2, 2021 17:51:41 GMT -5
You should at least give it a chance first. You have literally no idea what direction they're going to take it beyond "he has some hang-ups about his family legacy". Remember that all three of these cats are protagonists in the same arc, their plots are going to converge into the same story at some point. It's not like Flamepaw's going to be sitting around moping about not being Firestar while the other two are off fighting demons. All three will have moments of boredom and moments of interest. i'll be buying the first book as usual. i always gotta see if the arc will be good before i spend money on all 6 books (for the past 2 arcs now, i've only bought the first 3 then quit bc it was bad, and survived off spoiler threads). from other cats who dealt with this similar plot, they were annoying about it so im not looking forward to it again.
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Post by Chicken on Aug 2, 2021 17:52:52 GMT -5
I agree with most of your post, but Alderheart was a lot more relevant in AVOS than he's given credit for, like he discovered a new cure to save Puddleshine's life using deathberries, but for the most part, you're right, and I think his POV would have been WAY better in TBC over Bristlefrost, and Sunbeam would have been better for it than Shadowsight, because Ashfur talking to Alderheart would have made way more sense than some random ShadowClan cat. Back to the main point, I'm disappointed about what Flamepaw's arc might be too, oh his name is Flamepaw, and that's close to fire, so he has to live up to Firestar's legacy, or something, I haven't really seen anything that would tell me otherwise, why he would be worried about it, and other cats like Sparkpelt, Hollytuft, Snaptooth, etc wouldn't be. However, maybe his POV will give us a chance to learn more about his personality, and the personalities about the other cats in ThunderClan outside of just a small circle, but I highly doubt it. One thing I am disappointed about though, is that it's yet ANOTHER tom POV with one sister, this is the third time in a row. I honestly wish Flickerkit would have lived over Flame or Finch because his prefix is unique, and he is a tortie which a tortie POV in the main series would be new. I'm really interested in seeing where this arc goes, but I don't have much high hopes for it. Maybe WindClan will get their time to shine in the next arc or so. sparkpelt was said to look similar to firestar, and she never had to deal with this legacy issue...and yeah i know people will already say "well people handle issues differently" and i get that, but...why flamepaw specifically? why would the writers chose this plot for firekin all these years later? it makes no sense and it just sounds boring. we've been through similar plots like that before... Yeah, true. There might be more to the plot though than just his worries about his legacy, like who is his forbidden mate/crush going to be?
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Post by Skypaw13 on Aug 2, 2021 17:58:15 GMT -5
You should at least give it a chance first. You have literally no idea what direction they're going to take it beyond "he has some hang-ups about his family legacy". Remember that all three of these cats are protagonists in the same arc, their plots are going to converge into the same story at some point. It's not like Flamepaw's going to be sitting around moping about not being Firestar while the other two are off fighting demons. All three will have moments of boredom and moments of interest. from other cats who dealt with this similar plot, they were annoying about it so im not looking forward to it again. Genuine question: Who's had this plot before? Neither Leafpool or Squirrelflight had it, none of the original Three had it, Dovewing and Ivypool didn't have it, Alderheart had a hang up or two, but calling it a whole plot is pretty reachy, and Bristlefrost didn't have it. Rootspring is genuinely the only protagonist I can think of who had a plotline revolving around his family legacy, and that was a single-generation thing not even remotely comparable to Firestar, and it was actually good. EDIT: I guess Brambleclaw too, but that's not living UP to a family legacy, that's living DOWN a family legacy. Still a legacy plot though, so I guess it counts.
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Post by 🔥Firestar🔥 on Aug 2, 2021 17:58:43 GMT -5
I agree i did not want another POV in ThunderClan, but what makes it so interesting for me is the fact that he's struggling with the legacy of the literal heroes we've had for arcs. It's not just "My father was a murder" or anything, but his bloodline is a line of heroes and cats that literally saved the Clans, so i'm intrigued to know what he brings to the table.
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Post by *Faith* on Aug 2, 2021 19:01:02 GMT -5
I honestly wish Flickerkit would have lived over Flame or Finch because his prefix is unique, and he is a tortie which a tortie POV in the main series would be new. Finchpaw is also a tortoiseshell so this could've easily gone to her as well. Also, both Finch and Flicker are black-and-orange cats with brown splotches. Finchpaw having just a bit more in that department. I got this from their icon pictures on the family tree. Needless to say, I am hoping Finchpaw survives ALITM and gets a personality next arc.
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Post by Chicken on Aug 2, 2021 19:05:48 GMT -5
I honestly wish Flickerkit would have lived over Flame or Finch because his prefix is unique, and he is a tortie which a tortie POV in the main series would be new. Finchpaw is also a tortoiseshell so this could've easily gone to her as well. Also, both Finch and Flicker are black-and-orange cats with brown splotches. Finchpaw having just a bit more in that department. I got this from their icon pictures on the family tree. Needless to say, I am hoping Finchpaw survives ALITM and gets a personality next arc. Same, though, her dying in TBC could be interesting, I don't think we ever had a POV character where their littermate died after they were a kit, but before they were a warrior, but I hope she gets a personality too, that isn't just going against what her brother wants like Sparkpelt and Needleclaw. Speaking of torties, Hopwhisker would have been a better choice over Sunbeam IMO, the only thing that Sunbeam has to wonder about his the fact that her sister was Needletail, however, Hopwhisker's father was a member of the kin, I think she more than anyone would be having doubts or whatever.
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Post by *Faith* on Aug 2, 2021 19:10:50 GMT -5
Finchpaw is also a tortoiseshell so this could've easily gone to her as well. Also, both Finch and Flicker are black-and-orange cats with brown splotches. Finchpaw having just a bit more in that department. I got this from their icon pictures on the family tree. Needless to say, I am hoping Finchpaw survives ALITM and gets a personality next arc. Same, though, her dying in TBC could be interesting, I don't think we ever had a POV character where their littermate died after they were a kit, but before they were a warrior, but I hope she gets a personality too, that isn't just going against what her brother wants like Sparkpelt and Needleclaw. Speaking of torties, Hopwhisker would have been a better choice over Sunbeam IMO, the only thing that Sunbeam has to wonder about his the fact that her sister was Needletail, however, Hopwhisker's father was a member of the kin, I think she more than anyone would be having doubts or whatever. Ah, yes, Hopwhisker. The first cat in the series to specifically to be called a calico instead of a tortoiseshell. I don't think she has ever spoken. Actually, I don't think she even appeared in TBC and that goes for Sunbeam, too. At this point I think the writers/editors just put names in a hat and picked one at random. Literally. All the blurb says is that Sunbeam has "doubts of her own".
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Post by Chicken on Aug 2, 2021 19:14:43 GMT -5
Same, though, her dying in TBC could be interesting, I don't think we ever had a POV character where their littermate died after they were a kit, but before they were a warrior, but I hope she gets a personality too, that isn't just going against what her brother wants like Sparkpelt and Needleclaw. Speaking of torties, Hopwhisker would have been a better choice over Sunbeam IMO, the only thing that Sunbeam has to wonder about his the fact that her sister was Needletail, however, Hopwhisker's father was a member of the kin, I think she more than anyone would be having doubts or whatever. Ah, yes, Hopwhisker. The first cat in the series to specifically to be called a calico instead of a tortoiseshell. I don't think she has ever spoken. Actually, I don't think she even appeared in TBC and that goes for Sunbeam, too. At this point I think the writers/editors just put names in a hat and picked one at random. Literally. All the blurb says is that Sunbeam has "doubts of her own". Oh really? I agree, I honestly think Sunbeam could have been better for this arc, like give Alderheart Shadowsight/Bristlefrost's role, Sunbeam can be the eyes and ears into ShadowClan since they're accepting the exiled cats, as well as having a connection with Rootspring because she's Needletail's sister, and even though neither of them met Needletail, she's still important in their lives, and maybe Sunbeam can give him some clues as to what's going on with Violetshine, by sharing stuff she heard about Needletail from her parents/clanmates.
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Post by Fireleap on Aug 2, 2021 19:21:39 GMT -5
I'm holding out hope for Flamepaw because I've been enjoying the current ThunderClan POV but I have a sinking suspicion that you'll end up being right. Seeing him struggle to live up to the heroes that came before him could be really cool, but I'm not sure I trust the Erins/editors/Harper Collins to successfully pull it off. I'd honestly love to see him become friends with Ivypool, she also struggled with comparing herself to greatness and I think it'd be nice for Flamepaw to have someone to relate to. Like you mentioned in regards to Alderheart though, his POV won't be good if it doesn't have any plot relevance. As much as I'd love a WindClan POV I can live without it for another arc only if all the POVs are relevant. I don't wanna sit through another arc if 1/3 of the books is just obligatory ThunderClan filler.
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Post by Rainsplash on Aug 2, 2021 19:41:52 GMT -5
I don't mind we got a ThunderClan P.O.V. (I'd like a WindClan one for a ShadowClan one, to be frank), but it's true Firestar and his legacy trope's gone boring. Sure, I love Firestar but it's time he's dropped out of the plot and maybe appear sometimes in dreams. I don't get why he's still an apprentice anyway. He's been an apprentice and will be one for six books. Still I never get high hopes for anyone until I see it. tbh I don't look forward to Sunbeam, either.
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Post by Snowfire on Aug 2, 2021 23:58:41 GMT -5
I’m willing to give him a chance, I just wish they’ve gone for a WC or a non-Clan cat POV, just to spice things up a bit.
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Post by ʀᴀɪɴʟᴇᴀғ 🍁 on Aug 3, 2021 4:18:42 GMT -5
I'm glad we have another TC POV over a WC POV. I hate reading about them.
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Post by BҽɾɾყႦʅσσɱ on Aug 3, 2021 8:21:47 GMT -5
ThunderClan continues to be my favorite Clan (followed by SkyClan) so I don't mind getting another PoV from them in the next arc (or any other one) at all. Flamepaw might not seem to be the most interesting out of the three new protagonists so far but I'm sure that he'll have something going for him.
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Post by Goldy from Dappleclan on Aug 3, 2021 15:14:48 GMT -5
Weirdly enough I'm looking forward to him the most
Then Frostpaw (getting tired of med cat povs)
Then Sun, since I'll find it difficult to get attached to an already established warrior. Especially since I hate Shadowclan
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Post by ᏞᎪᎠᎽ Ꮎf fᎪᏁᎠᎾms ミ☆ on Aug 3, 2021 15:19:11 GMT -5
Weirdly enough I'm looking forward to him the most Then Frostpaw (getting tired of med cat povs) Then Sun, since I'll find it difficult to get attached to an already established warrior. Especially since I hate Shadowclan funny enough, i was hoping the opposite, that more people would be excited for frostpaw since it's a riverclan POV, sometihng we havent had since TNP (but even back then, feather and storm's pov chapters didnt mean anything and it only happened here and there, not enough like a whole arc's worth).
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Post by Ivyfalcon on Aug 3, 2021 19:22:15 GMT -5
Finchpaw is also a tortoiseshell so this could've easily gone to her as well. Also, both Finch and Flicker are black-and-orange cats with brown splotches. Finchpaw having just a bit more in that department. I got this from their icon pictures on the family tree. Needless to say, I am hoping Finchpaw survives ALITM and gets a personality next arc. I don't think we ever had a POV character where their littermate died after they were a kit, but before they were a warrior Hawkwing, unless you’re just counting main series POVs. I don’t think we have had any main series POVs with siblings that died as apprentices though, and I agree it could be interesting for Flamepaw. It could even further tie into his doubts about living up to his kin’s legacy if Finchpaw died since then he’d be the only one of Sparkpelt’s kits left to do so. I mean, there’s plenty of other kin (like LionCinder’s kits) but I could see them going this route. I probably would prefer Finchpaw to live though, as long as she actually has an interesting personality and does get screen time as the MC’s sibling.
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Post by Chicken on Aug 3, 2021 19:26:32 GMT -5
I don't think we ever had a POV character where their littermate died after they were a kit, but before they were a warrior Hawkwing, unless you’re just counting main series POVs. I don’t think we have had any main series POVs with siblings that died as apprentices though, and I agree it could be interesting for Flamepaw. It could even further tie into his doubts about living up to his kin’s legacy if Finchpaw died since then he’d be the only one of Sparkpelt’s kits left to do so. I mean, there’s plenty of other kin (like LionCinder’s kits) but I could see them going this route. I probably would prefer Finchpaw to live though, as long as she actually has an interesting personality and does get screen time as the MC’s sibling. Oh true, there's also Lilyheart and Seedpaw, but they're not main characters but even in the series, I don't recall many other than Spiderleg and Shrewpaw. Oh that's true! I'm just afraid they'll just make her another Sparkpelt or Needleclaw, someone super loyal to their clan, and against whatever their brother wants to do.
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Post by Ivyfalcon on Aug 3, 2021 19:29:24 GMT -5
Hawkwing, unless you’re just counting main series POVs. I don’t think we have had any main series POVs with siblings that died as apprentices though, and I agree it could be interesting for Flamepaw. It could even further tie into his doubts about living up to his kin’s legacy if Finchpaw died since then he’d be the only one of Sparkpelt’s kits left to do so. I mean, there’s plenty of other kin (like LionCinder’s kits) but I could see them going this route. I probably would prefer Finchpaw to live though, as long as she actually has an interesting personality and does get screen time as the MC’s sibling. Oh true, there's also Lilyheart and Seedpaw, but they're not main characters but even in the series, I don't recall many other than Spiderleg and Shrewpaw. Oh that's true! I'm just afraid they'll just make her another Sparkpelt or Needleclaw, someone super loyal to their clan, and against whatever their brother wants to do. Agreed. I like Sparkpelt, but we don’t need Finchpaw to be a copy of her mom (and Needleclaw).
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