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Post by cygna on Apr 19, 2021 13:40:37 GMT -5
She seems to be getting a lot of flack lately for being overused and people seem to be loosing sympathy for her.
But that brings us to this thread were the people who still like her character will defend her against the haters.
Okay people will think I have really flimsy morals for saying this but I honestly don't care that she killed Ravenwing, Frecklewish, and Appledusk. Actually I care a little that she killed Frecklewish and would have preferred if she killed Oakstar(the one who was actually responsible) but I want us to remember these cats have TERRIBLE laws and even good cats are constantly breaking them. So what I'll say is Mapleshade got a really raw deal in life and was punished for having a half clan affair when Appledusk and many others were not.
And now for the reason people really hate her, her overuse. I will agree than some of her appearences were unnessesry but I don't think hat should detract her from the intersting villain she was in Crookedstar's Promise.
Any Mapleshade fans still out there?
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#a3c5e6
Name Colour
𝓣𝓲𝓷𝓾𝓿𝓲𝓮𝓵
Warrior Fanatic
All hail me, the flower-flushing queen of Prague
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Post by 𝓣𝓲𝓷𝓾𝓿𝓲𝓮𝓵 on Apr 19, 2021 14:15:25 GMT -5
I don't have much sympathy for Mapleshade. No, she didn't deserve to get cheated or lose her kits, but I don't have to like her to feel sympathy for her. That being said, it was still really stupid of her to think everything would be okay when she told her Clan the truth when she knew what Oakstar was like, it was just plain disturbing that she used Birchface's name to hide the identity of her kits, and my sympathy for her just went completely down the drain when she tried to kill a pregnant Reedshine. And of course, there was her whole thing with Crookedstar.
I don't care much for her victims either, but I also don't think they deserved to die. Also, while Oakstar has the most blame, it's understandable why Mapleshade didn't go after him since he's, y'know, a leader. Losing his medicine cat and daughter seemed to be a far better punishment anyway.
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Post by ᏞᎪᎠᎽ Ꮎf fᎪᏁᎠᎾms ミ☆ on Apr 19, 2021 14:21:17 GMT -5
the only thing u can feel sorry for in regards for mapleshade is that she was cheated on and lost her kits. everything else after that is a no from me. i dont think anyone's out here being like "im glad she lost her kits, she deserved that" or anything. that would be crossing the line. everyone can agree that losing her kits in that moment got us to be sympathetic for her. but mapleshade did multiple things that crossed the line after losing her kits, so sympathy for how she is now doesnt apply in my mind.
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#a3c5e6
Name Colour
𝓣𝓲𝓷𝓾𝓿𝓲𝓮𝓵
Warrior Fanatic
All hail me, the flower-flushing queen of Prague
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Post by 𝓣𝓲𝓷𝓾𝓿𝓲𝓮𝓵 on Apr 19, 2021 14:47:33 GMT -5
the only thing u can feel sorry for in regards for mapleshade is that she was cheated on and lost her kits. everything else after that is a no from me. i dont think anyone's out here being like "im glad she lost her kits, she deserved that" or anything. that would be crossing the line. everyone can agree that losing her kits in that moment got us to be sympathetic for her. but mapleshade did multiple things that crossed the line after losing her kits, so sympathy for how she is now doesnt apply in my mind. Yeah, I can't think of anyone who's ever said they're happy she lost her kits. I'm pretty sure everyone can agree that outliving a child is the worst thing a parent can go through, never mind three. It's how she deals with the grief is what gets me.
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Post by *Ottersplash* on Apr 19, 2021 14:49:43 GMT -5
the only thing u can feel sorry for in regards for mapleshade is that she was cheated on and lost her kits. everything else after that is a no from me. i dont think anyone's out here being like "im glad she lost her kits, she deserved that" or anything. that would be crossing the line. everyone can agree that losing her kits in that moment got us to be sympathetic for her. but mapleshade did multiple things that crossed the line after losing her kits, so sympathy for how she is now doesnt apply in my mind. Yeah, I can't think of anyone who's ever said they're happy she lost her kits. I'm pretty sure everyone can agree that outliving a child is the worst thing a parent can go through, never mind three. It's how she deals with the grief is what gets me. The issue is that they blame the kits drowning on her when she was in a tight spot and I don't think deserves the blame she gets for that.
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Post by Cheetahstar on Apr 19, 2021 15:26:32 GMT -5
Yeah, I can't think of anyone who's ever said they're happy she lost her kits. I'm pretty sure everyone can agree that outliving a child is the worst thing a parent can go through, never mind three. It's how she deals with the grief is what gets me. The issue is that they blame the kits drowning on her when she was in a tight spot and I don't think deserves the blame she gets for that. Where was she supposed to go?
Kitty pet place? You mean where thunders siblings died, and all the dogs and rogues.... also tadpole died
kittypet place sucked for non kittypets.
Anyway I'm a Mapleshade fan and I don't hide that fact
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Post by 🔥Firestar🔥 on Apr 19, 2021 15:28:55 GMT -5
I'm too tired to write an essay on her, i'll probably do that tomorrow, but i'm personally neutral on her, leaning towards like. I like her character as a villian, but on her novella, i'm neutral towards her.
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Post by Mothdapple on Apr 19, 2021 16:07:06 GMT -5
I used to love her, and I’ve tried liking her again, but I just can’t. After my second reread recently, I cannot defend her actions or even like her for that matter.
Mapleshade shouldn’t have gotten with a RiverClan cat in the first place. She knew the consequences, but yet she did it anyways. Throughout her novella, she often seems to think that she is above the code. She thought she could get away with breaking the warrior code and was somehow surprised with the fact that she was punished? She also hinted at planning on using her kits as a bargaining chip in her relationship with Appledusk. She knew since the beginning of the book that Reedshine was a threat to their relationship as well as the code itself. She had thoughts around the lines of ‘these kits will ensure Appledusk is mine,’ which is a very toxic mindset when it comes to your mate and your kits.
And oh, what a surprise, her kits and almost Mapleshade herself drowned in an extremely flooded river in the middle of a storm while trying to cross it. Yes, the kits drowning was not Mapleshade’s fault, but she could’ve easily waited for a RiverClan patrol to help her and her kits cross. Yeah, Frecklewish was tailing her, but she was just ensuring that Mapleshade leaves ThunderClan territory. If Mapleshade only waited a couple of minutes, the patrol with Appledusk would’ve arrived and helped them cross. People tend to forget that Appledusk saved Mapleshade’s life here and the patrol tried their best to save the kits but they were too late. Also, people put flack on Frecklewish for not saving the kits when she herself cannot swim and her own brother drowned only moons prior. Plus, she knew the RiverClan patrol was nearby and assumed they would help.
Speaking of Frecklewish, she was quick to assume that Mapleshade’s kits were Birchface’s, yes. But she was in a big state of grief after losing her brother. She was hoping he would live on through his kits. Also, Mapleshade didn’t correct her, which is just the same as lying about it herself. Frecklewish took up the father role with Mapleshade’s kits with the assumption the were her brother’s. She defended Mapleshade at first when the news broke, but when she realized the truth, she was rightfully enraged. She was led on for moons that these kits were her brother’s, only for the news to break that they were actually the kits of the cat who killed her brother. Oakstar too was rightfully angry for the same reasons. Essentially lying about this to a grieving family was nasty on Mapleshade’s part and it would’ve been better if she told Frecklewish they weren’t Birchface’s from the get go. However, the kits should not have been banished. It was not their fault. Only Mapleshade needed to be punished.
Now, onto Ravenwing. It is implied that Ravenwing is young and inexperienced, mentioning that his mentor died not too long ago. He received an omen from StarClan that seemed to point at Mapleshade and her kits. So, he interpreted that omen the best he could. When he found Mapleshade and the kits (who should NOT be out of camp under any circumstance unless during an emergency) by the river, he knew what was going on. He had no idea that Oakstar was going to banish the kits. He was just doing his job by interpreting omens and sharing the truth to Oakstar. He was a newly-on-his-own medicine cat who was just doing his job. What Oakstar did with this information was up to Oakstar and Ravenwing had nothing to do with that.
Now, last but not least, Appledusk and Reedshine. Appledusk could’ve easily been with Reedshine prior to Mapleshade. It is shown at the gathering in the beginning of the novella that the two were already close. Yes, he cheated on both of his mates, but that doesn’t warrant death. And besides, Reedshine is completely innocent besides some justified rude comments to Mapleshade. She doesn’t deserve the flack she gets just for being “the other woman.” Appledusk did kill Birchface and Flowerpaw, but they were accidental deaths. He didn’t mean to kill them, but yet it’s often assumed by cats such as Oakstar and Frecklewish that he did mean to do it, and thus they hate him for that.
Besides accidentally killing two cats and cheating, he isn’t all too bad as the fandom makes him seem. Yes, he blames the kits’ deaths on Mapleshade and calls their relationship a mistake, but what else was he supposed to say while being judged by Darkstar and the whole Clan which is all he knows? He was likely pressured to act this way due to being put on trial. Appledusk did clearly care for Mapleshade and the kits earlier on in the novella, but the truth being revealed turned that around. Yes, it was a jerk move. BUT BEING A JERK OR CHEATING DOES NOT WARRANT DEATH OR THE DARK FOREST.
One of the biggest things that made me hate Mapleshade is her fans. Some of them heavily justify Mapleshade’s actions, make her seem like a badass #girlboss, and say that cats such as Appledusk deserve the dark forest while MAPLESHADE DIDNT? Mapleshade killed 3 innocent cats. Ravenwing was just doing his job as a medicine cat, Frecklewish was grieving and in distress just as Mapleshade was over her kits, and Appledusk only cheated, was a jerk, and accidentally killed two cats. Mapleshade purposely killed 3 cats based off her own delusions and attempted to kill a pregnant queen. If you like her as a VILLAIN, that’s fine. But please don’t glorify her. She is by no means a good cat and if you think she is a justified villain, please read Crookedstar’s Promise. You won’t defend her so much after that.
THE TRUE VICTIMS ARE MAPLESHADE’S KITS. Thank you for coming to my TedTalk.
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Post by Brindlefern on Apr 19, 2021 18:12:55 GMT -5
I used to love her, and I’ve tried liking her again, but I just can’t. After my second reread recently, I cannot defend her actions or even like her for that matter. Mapleshade shouldn’t have gotten with a RiverClan cat in the first place. She knew the consequences, but yet she did it anyways. Throughout her novella, she often seems to think that she is above the code. She thought she could get away with breaking the warrior code and was somehow surprised with the fact that she was punished? She also hinted at planning on using her kits as a bargaining chip in her relationship with Appledusk. She knew since the beginning of the book that Reedshine was a threat to their relationship as well as the code itself. She had thoughts around the lines of ‘these kits will ensure Appledusk is mine,’ which is a very toxic mindset when it comes to your mate and your kits. And oh, what a surprise, her kits and almost Mapleshade herself drowned in an extremely flooded river in the middle of a storm while trying to cross it. Yes, the kits drowning was not Mapleshade’s fault, but she could’ve easily waited for a RiverClan patrol to help her and her kits cross. Yeah, Frecklewish was tailing her, but she was just ensuring that Mapleshade leaves ThunderClan territory. If Mapleshade only waited a couple of minutes, the patrol with Appledusk would’ve arrived and helped them cross. People tend to forget that Appledusk saved Mapleshade’s life here and the patrol tried their best to save the kits but they were too late. Also, people put flack on Frecklewish for not saving the kits when she herself cannot swim and her own brother drowned only moons prior. Plus, she knew the RiverClan patrol was nearby and assumed they would help. Speaking of Frecklewish, she was quick to assume that Mapleshade’s kits were Birchface’s, yes. But she was in a big state of grief after losing her brother. She was hoping he would live on through his kits. Also, Mapleshade didn’t correct her, which is just the same as lying about it herself. Frecklewish took up the father role with Mapleshade’s kits with the assumption the were her brother’s. She defended Mapleshade at first when the news broke, but when she realized the truth, she was rightfully enraged. She was led on for moons that these kits were her brother’s, only for the news to break that they were actually the kits of the cat who killed her brother. Oakstar too was rightfully angry for the same reasons. Essentially lying about this to a grieving family was nasty on Mapleshade’s part and it would’ve been better if she told Frecklewish they weren’t Birchface’s from the get go. However, the kits should not have been banished. It was not their fault. Only Mapleshade needed to be punished. Now, onto Ravenwing. It is implied that Ravenwing is young and inexperienced, mentioning that his mentor died not too long ago. He received an omen from StarClan that seemed to point at Mapleshade and her kits. So, he interpreted that omen the best he could. When he found Mapleshade and the kits (who should NOT be out of camp under any circumstance unless during an emergency) by the river, he knew what was going on. He had no idea that Oakstar was going to banish the kits. He was just doing his job by interpreting omens and sharing the truth to Oakstar. He was a newly-on-his-own medicine cat who was just doing his job. What Oakstar did with this information was up to Oakstar and Ravenwing had nothing to do with that. Now, last but not least, Appledusk and Reedshine. Appledusk could’ve easily been with Reedshine prior to Mapleshade. It is shown at the gathering in the beginning of the novella that the two were already close. Yes, he cheated on both of his mates, but that doesn’t warrant death. And besides, Reedshine is completely innocent besides some justified rude comments to Mapleshade. She doesn’t deserve the flack she gets just for being “the other woman.” Appledusk did kill Birchface and Flowerpaw, but they were accidental deaths. He didn’t mean to kill them, but yet it’s often assumed by cats such as Oakstar and Frecklewish that he did mean to do it, and thus they hate him for that. Besides accidentally killing two cats and cheating, he isn’t all too bad as the fandom makes him seem. Yes, he blames the kits’ deaths on Mapleshade and calls their relationship a mistake, but what else was he supposed to say while being judged by Darkstar and the whole Clan which is all he knows? He was likely pressured to act this way due to being put on trial. Appledusk did clearly care for Mapleshade and the kits earlier on in the novella, but the truth being revealed turned that around. Yes, it was a jerk move. BUT BEING A JERK OR CHEATING DOES NOT WARRANT DEATH OR THE DARK FOREST. One of the biggest things that made me hate Mapleshade is her fans. Some of them heavily justify Mapleshade’s actions, make her seem like a badass #girlboss, and say that cats such as Appledusk deserve the dark forest while MAPLESHADE DIDNT? Mapleshade killed 3 innocent cats. Ravenwing was just doing his job as a medicine cat, Frecklewish was grieving and in distress just as Mapleshade was over her kits, and Appledusk only cheated, was a jerk, and accidentally killed two cats. Mapleshade purposely killed 3 cats based off her own delusions and attempted to kill a pregnant queen. If you like her as a VILLAIN, that’s fine. But please don’t glorify her. She is by no means a good cat and if you think she is a justified villain, please read Crookedstar’s Promise. You won’t defend her so much after that. THE TRUE VICTIMS ARE MAPLESHADE’S KITS. Thank you for coming to my TedTalk. Can I marry this comment? I even got a ring ready.
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Post by Rainsplash on Apr 19, 2021 19:10:45 GMT -5
I used to love her, and I’ve tried liking her again, but I just can’t. After my second reread recently, I cannot defend her actions or even like her for that matter. Mapleshade shouldn’t have gotten with a RiverClan cat in the first place. She knew the consequences, but yet she did it anyways. Throughout her novella, she often seems to think that she is above the code. She thought she could get away with breaking the warrior code and was somehow surprised with the fact that she was punished? She also hinted at planning on using her kits as a bargaining chip in her relationship with Appledusk. She knew since the beginning of the book that Reedshine was a threat to their relationship as well as the code itself. She had thoughts around the lines of ‘these kits will ensure Appledusk is mine,’ which is a very toxic mindset when it comes to your mate and your kits. And oh, what a surprise, her kits and almost Mapleshade herself drowned in an extremely flooded river in the middle of a storm while trying to cross it. Yes, the kits drowning was not Mapleshade’s fault, but she could’ve easily waited for a RiverClan patrol to help her and her kits cross. Yeah, Frecklewish was tailing her, but she was just ensuring that Mapleshade leaves ThunderClan territory. If Mapleshade only waited a couple of minutes, the patrol with Appledusk would’ve arrived and helped them cross. People tend to forget that Appledusk saved Mapleshade’s life here and the patrol tried their best to save the kits but they were too late. Also, people put flack on Frecklewish for not saving the kits when she herself cannot swim and her own brother drowned only moons prior. Plus, she knew the RiverClan patrol was nearby and assumed they would help. Speaking of Frecklewish, she was quick to assume that Mapleshade’s kits were Birchface’s, yes. But she was in a big state of grief after losing her brother. She was hoping he would live on through his kits. Also, Mapleshade didn’t correct her, which is just the same as lying about it herself. Frecklewish took up the father role with Mapleshade’s kits with the assumption the were her brother’s. She defended Mapleshade at first when the news broke, but when she realized the truth, she was rightfully enraged. She was led on for moons that these kits were her brother’s, only for the news to break that they were actually the kits of the cat who killed her brother. Oakstar too was rightfully angry for the same reasons. Essentially lying about this to a grieving family was nasty on Mapleshade’s part and it would’ve been better if she told Frecklewish they weren’t Birchface’s from the get go. However, the kits should not have been banished. It was not their fault. Only Mapleshade needed to be punished. Now, onto Ravenwing. It is implied that Ravenwing is young and inexperienced, mentioning that his mentor died not too long ago. He received an omen from StarClan that seemed to point at Mapleshade and her kits. So, he interpreted that omen the best he could. When he found Mapleshade and the kits (who should NOT be out of camp under any circumstance unless during an emergency) by the river, he knew what was going on. He had no idea that Oakstar was going to banish the kits. He was just doing his job by interpreting omens and sharing the truth to Oakstar. He was a newly-on-his-own medicine cat who was just doing his job. What Oakstar did with this information was up to Oakstar and Ravenwing had nothing to do with that. Now, last but not least, Appledusk and Reedshine. Appledusk could’ve easily been with Reedshine prior to Mapleshade. It is shown at the gathering in the beginning of the novella that the two were already close. Yes, he cheated on both of his mates, but that doesn’t warrant death. And besides, Reedshine is completely innocent besides some justified rude comments to Mapleshade. She doesn’t deserve the flack she gets just for being “the other woman.” Appledusk did kill Birchface and Flowerpaw, but they were accidental deaths. He didn’t mean to kill them, but yet it’s often assumed by cats such as Oakstar and Frecklewish that he did mean to do it, and thus they hate him for that. Besides accidentally killing two cats and cheating, he isn’t all too bad as the fandom makes him seem. Yes, he blames the kits’ deaths on Mapleshade and calls their relationship a mistake, but what else was he supposed to say while being judged by Darkstar and the whole Clan which is all he knows? He was likely pressured to act this way due to being put on trial. Appledusk did clearly care for Mapleshade and the kits earlier on in the novella, but the truth being revealed turned that around. Yes, it was a jerk move. BUT BEING A JERK OR CHEATING DOES NOT WARRANT DEATH OR THE DARK FOREST. One of the biggest things that made me hate Mapleshade is her fans. Some of them heavily justify Mapleshade’s actions, make her seem like a badass #girlboss, and say that cats such as Appledusk deserve the dark forest while MAPLESHADE DIDNT? Mapleshade killed 3 innocent cats. Ravenwing was just doing his job as a medicine cat, Frecklewish was grieving and in distress just as Mapleshade was over her kits, and Appledusk only cheated, was a jerk, and accidentally killed two cats. Mapleshade purposely killed 3 cats based off her own delusions and attempted to kill a pregnant queen. If you like her as a VILLAIN, that’s fine. But please don’t glorify her. She is by no means a good cat and if you think she is a justified villain, please read Crookedstar’s Promise. You won’t defend her so much after that. THE TRUE VICTIMS ARE MAPLESHADE’S KITS. Thank you for coming to my TedTalk. Yes
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Post by Mothdapple on Apr 19, 2021 19:25:05 GMT -5
I used to love her, and I’ve tried liking her again, but I just can’t. After my second reread recently, I cannot defend her actions or even like her for that matter. Mapleshade shouldn’t have gotten with a RiverClan cat in the first place. She knew the consequences, but yet she did it anyways. Throughout her novella, she often seems to think that she is above the code. She thought she could get away with breaking the warrior code and was somehow surprised with the fact that she was punished? She also hinted at planning on using her kits as a bargaining chip in her relationship with Appledusk. She knew since the beginning of the book that Reedshine was a threat to their relationship as well as the code itself. She had thoughts around the lines of ‘these kits will ensure Appledusk is mine,’ which is a very toxic mindset when it comes to your mate and your kits. And oh, what a surprise, her kits and almost Mapleshade herself drowned in an extremely flooded river in the middle of a storm while trying to cross it. Yes, the kits drowning was not Mapleshade’s fault, but she could’ve easily waited for a RiverClan patrol to help her and her kits cross. Yeah, Frecklewish was tailing her, but she was just ensuring that Mapleshade leaves ThunderClan territory. If Mapleshade only waited a couple of minutes, the patrol with Appledusk would’ve arrived and helped them cross. People tend to forget that Appledusk saved Mapleshade’s life here and the patrol tried their best to save the kits but they were too late. Also, people put flack on Frecklewish for not saving the kits when she herself cannot swim and her own brother drowned only moons prior. Plus, she knew the RiverClan patrol was nearby and assumed they would help. Speaking of Frecklewish, she was quick to assume that Mapleshade’s kits were Birchface’s, yes. But she was in a big state of grief after losing her brother. She was hoping he would live on through his kits. Also, Mapleshade didn’t correct her, which is just the same as lying about it herself. Frecklewish took up the father role with Mapleshade’s kits with the assumption the were her brother’s. She defended Mapleshade at first when the news broke, but when she realized the truth, she was rightfully enraged. She was led on for moons that these kits were her brother’s, only for the news to break that they were actually the kits of the cat who killed her brother. Oakstar too was rightfully angry for the same reasons. Essentially lying about this to a grieving family was nasty on Mapleshade’s part and it would’ve been better if she told Frecklewish they weren’t Birchface’s from the get go. However, the kits should not have been banished. It was not their fault. Only Mapleshade needed to be punished. Now, onto Ravenwing. It is implied that Ravenwing is young and inexperienced, mentioning that his mentor died not too long ago. He received an omen from StarClan that seemed to point at Mapleshade and her kits. So, he interpreted that omen the best he could. When he found Mapleshade and the kits (who should NOT be out of camp under any circumstance unless during an emergency) by the river, he knew what was going on. He had no idea that Oakstar was going to banish the kits. He was just doing his job by interpreting omens and sharing the truth to Oakstar. He was a newly-on-his-own medicine cat who was just doing his job. What Oakstar did with this information was up to Oakstar and Ravenwing had nothing to do with that. Now, last but not least, Appledusk and Reedshine. Appledusk could’ve easily been with Reedshine prior to Mapleshade. It is shown at the gathering in the beginning of the novella that the two were already close. Yes, he cheated on both of his mates, but that doesn’t warrant death. And besides, Reedshine is completely innocent besides some justified rude comments to Mapleshade. She doesn’t deserve the flack she gets just for being “the other woman.” Appledusk did kill Birchface and Flowerpaw, but they were accidental deaths. He didn’t mean to kill them, but yet it’s often assumed by cats such as Oakstar and Frecklewish that he did mean to do it, and thus they hate him for that. Besides accidentally killing two cats and cheating, he isn’t all too bad as the fandom makes him seem. Yes, he blames the kits’ deaths on Mapleshade and calls their relationship a mistake, but what else was he supposed to say while being judged by Darkstar and the whole Clan which is all he knows? He was likely pressured to act this way due to being put on trial. Appledusk did clearly care for Mapleshade and the kits earlier on in the novella, but the truth being revealed turned that around. Yes, it was a jerk move. BUT BEING A JERK OR CHEATING DOES NOT WARRANT DEATH OR THE DARK FOREST. One of the biggest things that made me hate Mapleshade is her fans. Some of them heavily justify Mapleshade’s actions, make her seem like a badass #girlboss, and say that cats such as Appledusk deserve the dark forest while MAPLESHADE DIDNT? Mapleshade killed 3 innocent cats. Ravenwing was just doing his job as a medicine cat, Frecklewish was grieving and in distress just as Mapleshade was over her kits, and Appledusk only cheated, was a jerk, and accidentally killed two cats. Mapleshade purposely killed 3 cats based off her own delusions and attempted to kill a pregnant queen. If you like her as a VILLAIN, that’s fine. But please don’t glorify her. She is by no means a good cat and if you think she is a justified villain, please read Crookedstar’s Promise. You won’t defend her so much after that. THE TRUE VICTIMS ARE MAPLESHADE’S KITS. Thank you for coming to my TedTalk. Can I marry this comment? I even got a ring ready.If it’s a ring pop, absolutely /j
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Post by Lizard 🦎 on Apr 19, 2021 21:34:31 GMT -5
I have no sympathy for Mapleshade and I never will.
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Post by *Ottersplash* on Apr 19, 2021 22:10:03 GMT -5
The issue is that they blame the kits drowning on her when she was in a tight spot and I don't think deserves the blame she gets for that. Where was she supposed to go?
Kitty pet place? You mean where thunders siblings died, and all the dogs and rogues.... also tadpole died
kittypet place sucked for non kittypets.
Anyway I'm a Mapleshade fan and I don't hide that fact
I agree with you. She was probably panicked too. People should criticize her for her reactions after her kits death and maybe her naivete in thinking everything would be just fine, but her kits dying was Oakstar's fault
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Post by Cheetahstar on Apr 19, 2021 23:00:44 GMT -5
Where was she supposed to go?
Kitty pet place? You mean where thunders siblings died, and all the dogs and rogues.... also tadpole died
kittypet place sucked for non kittypets.
Anyway I'm a Mapleshade fan and I don't hide that fact
I agree with you. She was probably panicked too. People should criticize her for her reactions after her kits death and maybe her naivete in thinking everything would be just fine, but her kits dying was Oakstar's fault *turns on megaphone*
Oakstar is a trash leader up there with Leopardstar and Blackstar
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Post by *Ottersplash* on Apr 19, 2021 23:14:32 GMT -5
I agree with you. She was probably panicked too. People should criticize her for her reactions after her kits death and maybe her naivete in thinking everything would be just fine, but her kits dying was Oakstar's fault *turns on megaphone*
Oakstar is a trash leader up there with Leopardstar and Blackstar
I agree with Leopardstar, but I'm gonna have to disagree about Blackstar. Bad deputy, but good leader.
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Post by ❅Maplefrost❅ on Apr 20, 2021 0:22:24 GMT -5
I like Mapleshade. Still do. And I think when people say she's overused, feels like a stretch. Especially when she shows up in stories that makes sense for her to show up in, so...ya know. As for her "victims", it annoys me that people only defend them because they dislike Mapleshade and just completely gloss over how they treated her in the first place. Or when people disregard that Mapleshade herself is a victim. Does it excuse her actions? No, but the rest of the cast in the novella aren't much likable either, hard to feel sorry for sleazy boyfriends and hypocritical warriors. That aside, here's my current favorite Mapleshade video:
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Post by Mothdapple on Apr 20, 2021 1:18:12 GMT -5
I like Mapleshade. Still do. And I think when people say she's overused, feels like a stretch. Especially when she shows up in stories that makes sense for her to show up in, so...ya know. As for her "victims", it annoys me that people only defend them because they dislike Mapleshade and just completely gloss over how they treated her in the first place. Or when people disregard that Mapleshade herself is a victim. Does it excuse her actions? No, but the rest of the cast in the novella aren't much likable either, hard to feel sorry for sleazy boyfriends and hypocritical warriors. That aside, here's my current favorite Mapleshade video: I think that AMV is something that both Mapleshade fans and haters can both like. I prefer it over any other Mapleshade animation since I feel like it’s the only one the shows the full story. A lot of Mapleshade animations are overdramaticized or try to make her look badass. Rather, this animation shows things are are often not shown in Mapleshade animations (Birchface and Flowerpaw’s deaths, Ravenwing’s omen, Frecklewish cooing over Mapleshade’s kits, Appledusk saving Mapleshade from the river, Appledusk jumping in to save Reedshine instead of her straight-up killing Apple, Crookedstar, etc). This is the best Mapleshade animation out there and I wish it had more attention.
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Post by Aqua on Apr 20, 2021 11:45:07 GMT -5
The problem with Mapleshade is that her novella is rushed and it paints her as a sympathetic character who hasn't done anything wrong. While some fans don't believe that she's in the right, most actually agree with her, and even Mapleshade herself believes she hasn't done anything wrong even as she's killing the victims.
Her book also had 0 cats sympathizing with her situation. She was a homeless queen with very young kits and nobody cared about that. You'd think that at least one or two cats would sympathize with her and try to defend her in ThunderClan before she was exiled, right? This makes her situation feel incredibly forced and it's hard for me to believe that nobody actually cares about a queen and her kits. It's just for the plot and it's bad writing.
She lied to her clan. I'm not mad at her for breaking the warrior code; everyone has done that at least once in their life, and nobody really cares about the warrior code these days anyways. I'm more angry at the fact that she took advantage of her Clan's grief and used a dead warrior to cover up her mistakes. And Ravenwing is killed for simply being honest to his clan. What do fans expect him to do? Cover up for her mistakes? They get mad at anyone else who wants to cover up their mistakes, so why does Mapleshade get a free pass for this behavior? He was a medicine cat. He had every right to call her out for it.
That's another thing. I'm frustrated with how her fans treat her. They believe she deserves StarClan for "avenging the kits' deaths" when she was the one who killed cats in cold blood, and enjoyed doing it with no regrets. No, she doesn't deserve to be exiled along with her kits, but people need to understand that she's not innocent no matter what has happened to her. Someone else's bad actions doesn't make the other one any better.
She treated her kits as possessions. It was an unhealthy mindset and she truly believed that her kits would solve the Clans' problems. She actually thought everyone would be fine with her when she told the truth. She was planning to tell them eventually, which was just stupid on her part.
Her kits' deaths weren't entirely her fault, but she should've taken a better route. She didn't know Frecklewish was watching her, and even so Frecklewish said so herself that she didn't want the kits to die. The river was dangerous and she took them there anyways. Even the kits knew it wasn't safe and they didn't want to cross! I'm sorry, but while I don't agree with Appledusk cheating on her or blaming her for everything, I can't entirely blame him for getting mad at her for his kits' deaths.
Attempting to kill Reedshine was disgusting. She's literally done nothing wrong except tell Mapleshade to go away. She has 0 obligation to be nice to a ThunderClan cat, and for all she knew, she was trespassing and carried dead kits with her. THAT'S ALL REEDSHINE SAW DURING THAT TIME. Can you BLAME her for acting cold? Reedshine didn't know the full story, she only knew Mapleshade was the "other woman", and that there were dead kits. It doesn't help that she was also hearing from Appledusk that Mapleshade killed her kits. She's obviously going to side with Appledusk rather than a stranger, and feel more sorry for her MATE than a rival Clan cat. Mapleshade has always been hostile to Reedshine, and got mad at her more than Appledusk, when he was the one cheating on BOTH of them. Reedshine has done nothing wrong, she simply misunderstood Mapleshade's situation, and EVEN SO, why do people get so mad at her for being unsympathetic? Why should she be? She's a rival clan cat. From her own PoV, Mapleshade killed the kits and she's trespassing her territory. She definitely didn't owe her any sympathy, especially after nearly killing her and her mate too lol.
Frecklewish is the most questionable one with her own behavior, imo. She was the first to say she wanted to exile the kits and even attacked Mapleshade's face. However, what I want to point out is that she was grieving over brother's death. I can understand why she acted the way she did, even if her behavior was wrong. To her, the kits were her kin, a part of her blood. It gave her hope that a part of her brother lived on through Mapleshade's kittens. At the time, Mapleshade didn't even think about her friend's feelings, she just wanted a reason to protect her kits, and used this as an excuse to lie to her clan. So she continued letting Frecklewish believe that they were her brothers, which was really cruel on Mapleshade's part. Mapleshade wasn't fair to her, and not only did lie to just Frecklewish, but Oakstar too, when she KNEW he wanted to get revenge on Appledusk. She KNEW they both hated Appledusk, but she still lied to them.
Mapleshade really should've kept quiet from the beginning. That plan was working. Bluestar herself said that if a queen doesn't want to tell who the father is, they don't have to. Nobody was question Mapleshade about the father, they were only questioning their behavior. It was Mapleshade's fault for everything. If she hadn't took the kits to the river in the first place and kept quiet, she and her kits would have been fine. She didn't plan ahead, and I can't really defend her for her stupid, selfish actions.
Mapleshade is entitled, stupid, selfish, manipulative, and delusional. There's not even anything likable about her before she turns evil. Everyone else who broke the warrior code at least had a plan to protect their own kits. They were smarter about it. She was the only one who didn't think ahead of her time and immediately though her clan would be totally okay for lying about their DECEASED FAMILY MEMBER WHILE THEY WERE STILL GRIEVING. She was the ONLY one for actually believing her clan wouldn't be mad at her for this. Everyone else had some common sense, knew that their clans would be angry for lying, even if they did handle it wrong! God, she's so stupid. I really can't stand her.
THE KITS WERE THE TRUE VICTIMS. Nobody else here was innocent, not even Mapleshade.
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Post by 🔥Firestar🔥 on Apr 20, 2021 12:02:02 GMT -5
Adding into what Dawncloud said: It is partly her fault she got exiled. She told Frecklewish in front of her face to "especially" tell Appledusk that she had 3 kits at the Gathering, she brought the kits to the riverbank and talked lovingly with Appledusk, and she refused to take 0 responsability at the moment of her exile. Atleast Darkstar saw that Appledusk showed remorse, and was willing to change, wich may have encouraged her to let him stay. Mapleshade on the other hand, refused to own up to her mistake of lying and breaking the code, and even threathened ThunderClan after being exiled.
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Post by Aqua on Apr 20, 2021 12:07:11 GMT -5
Adding into what Dawncloud said: It is partly her fault she got exiled. She told Frecklewish in front of her face to "especially" tell Appledusk that she had 3 kits at the Gathering, she brought the kits to the riverbank and talked lovingly with Appledusk, and she refused to take 0 responsability at the moment of her exile. Atleast Darkstar saw that Appledusk showed remorse, and was willing to change, wich may have encouraged her to let him stay. Mapleshade on the other hand, refused to own up to her mistake of lying and breaking the code, and even threathened ThunderClan after being exiled. Yeah, that's another reason why I don't like her. She doesn't own up to her mistakes. I understand she truly believed they were wrong after she was exiled, and I can sympathize that she was grieving over her kits. But she didn't once try to understand anyone's feelings for Birchface. She sided with Appledusk and defended him multiple times when they mentioned they're angry at him for killing him, and never once sympathized their grief. She really didn't care about her Clanmates at all, only about herself. She's truly one of the most selfish characters I've ever read in warriors, and I mean that. At least the others who broke the code either stopped lying and fixed their mistakes or admitted they were wrong and did the right thing! Mapleshade didn't do any of this, just blamed them and kept acting like the victim and believed she didn't do anything wrong to them.
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Post by Flamefrost on Apr 20, 2021 12:25:43 GMT -5
Another thing people don't often mention is how her lie about Birchface was COMPLETELY unecessary. It's pretty common in the Clans for she-cats not to disclose the father of their kits. She lied and exploited the feelings of her Clanmates to give her kits a higher status in the Clan. Frecklewish was absolutely justified in hating her.
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Post by Mothdapple on Apr 20, 2021 12:29:51 GMT -5
Another thing people don't often mention is how her lie about Birchface was COMPLETELY unecessary. It's pretty common in the Clans for she-cats not to disclose the father of their kits. She lied and exploited the feelings of her Clanmates to give her kits a higher status in the Clan. Frecklewish was absolutely justified in hating her. People bring up the fact that Mapleshade didn't explicitly say that the kits were Birchface's, but staying silent and letting Frecklewish, Oakstar, and her other Clanmates believe this is just as bad as lying about it herself. It's called lying by omission, which is just as bad as lying about it herself.
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Post by cygna on Apr 20, 2021 12:57:38 GMT -5
okay I will say this as nicely as possible, this is a Mapleshade defense thread. So if everyone's going to hate on her please do it somewhere else. Maybe make a thread on why she sucks (which is something I will gladly not join & spread Mapleshade positivity on), but please don't go against everything I'm trying to do here.
please don't hate on me okay, I just feel that this is going in the wrong direction.
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Post by 🔥Firestar🔥 on Apr 20, 2021 13:07:56 GMT -5
okay I will say this as nicely as possible, this is a Mapleshade defense thread. So if everyone's going to hate on her please do it somewhere else. Maybe make a thread on why she sucks (which is something I will gladly not join & spread Mapleshade positivity on), but please don't go against everything I'm trying to do here. please don't hate on me okay, I just feel that this is going in the wrong direction. Oh, sorry. I guess i saw a lot of posts talking about their opinion on Mapleshade, and i misunderstood. I'll try to say what i enjoy about Mapleshade from now on.
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Post by Mothdapple on Apr 20, 2021 13:44:43 GMT -5
okay I will say this as nicely as possible, this is a Mapleshade defense thread. So if everyone's going to hate on her please do it somewhere else. Maybe make a thread on why she sucks (which is something I will gladly not join & spread Mapleshade positivity on), but please don't go against everything I'm trying to do here. please don't hate on me okay, I just feel that this is going in the wrong direction. Oh, I thought this was free for any opinion, my bad.
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Post by vectoring34 on Apr 20, 2021 14:09:44 GMT -5
Mapleshade is an unfortunate case where both her rabid defenders and her antis are ridiculous. Obviously the rabid defenders painting her as some awesome empowering character who would rescue Squirrelflight from Brambleclaw or whatever are incredibly annoying, I don't need to get into that. But some of the arguments against her really do get into the ridiculous and seem to be scrambling at things to get angry at. Her crossing the river was not a bad idea, it was the best option out of a series of really bad ideas she had available to her.
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Post by Saint Ambrosef on Apr 20, 2021 15:10:25 GMT -5
i think mapleshade's crime was a little bit more than just having a half-clan affair. i dont think they would have kicked her out just for that. from what i read, the main issue seemed to be that she lied about the father being a well-loved hero, and that the actual father was (thought to be) the brutal murderer of that same cat. not saying that excuses them throwing a queen and young kits out. but i think it's a little bit of a disservice to the narrative to suggest it was ONLY because mapleshade took a non-thunderclan mate.
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Post by Card against Humanity on Apr 20, 2021 15:11:39 GMT -5
Mapleshade is an unfortunate case where both her rabid defenders and her antis are ridiculous. Obviously the rabid defenders painting her as some awesome empowering character who would rescue Squirrelflight from Brambleclaw or whatever are incredibly annoying, I don't need to get into that. But some of the arguments against her really do get into the ridiculous and seem to be scrambling at things to get angry at. Her crossing the river was not a bad idea, it was the best option out of a series of really bad ideas she had available to her. not to mention the people defending all the cats in her book who screwed her over as if they did nothing wrong
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Post by Aqua on Apr 20, 2021 16:28:02 GMT -5
i think mapleshade's crime was a little bit more than just having a half-clan affair. i dont think they would have kicked her out just for that. from what i read, the main issue seemed to be that she lied about the father being a well-loved hero, and that the actual father was (thought to be) the brutal murderer of that same cat. not saying that excuses them throwing a queen and young kits out. but i think it's a little bit of a disservice to the narrative to suggest it was ONLY because mapleshade took a non-thunderclan mate. i feel like if she hadn't lied about Birchface in the first place, her clan might've gone easier on her and the kits. they were definitely more angry about her lying about him than breaking the warrior code.
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