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Post by Gargoyle on Jul 25, 2018 7:38:12 GMT -5
I've kind of just been lurking on the forums since I joined these ones and haven't posted or rped much... but as I was working on one of my fanfictions (which, of course, takes place in the original Clans) I was thinking I might very much like to do a roleplay with the original Clans... unfortunately, it seems like those tend to be rather few and far between, and those that exist tend to be either not especially active, or flooded with waaaay too many characters/players who may or may not be active, or some measure of both. So, I thought, why not try my hand at making my own?
Of course, I don't really want to do it alone. Mainly because five Clans would be a lot to manage on my own. Plus, I would definitely want to make sure that the interest is there. And, the fact of the matter is also that because of my work schedule, I don't have a whole lot of time to be on the forums, so while I could certainly, eh, oversee the entire roleplay, and probably manage like, one Clan, I don't think I can manage five at the moment without becoming very quickly burned out. And, unfortunately, I have a very bad habit of simply dropping things without warning when they burn me out (which, on the forums, would probably amount to simply... not getting back on for a while. And for the sake of the roleplay surviving, I desperately would want to avoid that).
That said, I am hoping to create a long-lasting roleplay that is more on the end of literate than not, and I'll explain what I mean by both of those things. I've always seen (though, alas, never been a part of) those kinds of Clans that by some miracle manage to last in-game years or even generations, where people eventually end up playing the kits or even grandkits of their original characters, and so much has happened that one can scarcely keep track of the nuances of the roleplay's entire history, and I've always wanted to achieve something like that. However, best I've been able to manage is a few moons, and usually then only with the aid of a time skip, heh. In any case, to this end I would be looking for helpers to run the Clans who are capable and willing to stick to one Clan and one roleplay for what will hopefully a very long time- and, if a time comes that they find they are incapable or unwilling to continue, will be okay with passing on that Clan to someone else. On this front, each Clan would probably also want one or two designated moderators, since there will obviously be times that the creators will have to take a break from the forums or will be unable to be active for some time, and in order to make a roleplay last, we can't really afford to just pause the roleplay for a few days or a few weeks until the creator can return. From an editing standpoint (as far as adding in new characters and such if the OP is unable to do so for a long period of time)... I have a couple ideas, but we'll talk about it.
Next, the literacy. As mentioned, I'm thinking of doing something a bit higher-end. Typically, Clan success (or at least, longevity) tends to count on quantity rather than quality. That is, lots and lots of people who are not necessarily good writers/roleplayers join, and some of them are just dedicated enough to continuously put forth tons of low-effort but high-drama posts for weeks or sometimes months. So, you end up with a long (in terms of number of posts) roleplays where lots has happened, but none of it is very... eloquent, from a grammatical or story-weaving standpoint. This is what I want to avoid. I would much rather have a somewhat slower-moving roleplay with more attention towards making a decent story ("story" not necessarily even meaning the overall plot of the entire roleplay, but even just each character's individual arcs). So, slightly longer posts and more attention to the writing, but of course we still want the roleplaying itself to be fun. So, I say "literate," but I really mean that more from the story-telling perspective than the writing perspective. Decent length posts and overall good grammar is a must, of course, but I'm mostly focused on people who would be able to keep the story going and keep characters developing and keep the timeline moving in meaningful ways rather than just by throwing out needless drama for the sake of "something" happening. Not sure what the word for that kind of literacy would be but... yeah.
Finally, perhaps the most important part, and the moment you've all been waiting for: the plot and the Clans. I do have an idea for what the main plot, at least for the first while of the roleplay, could be; spoiler alert, it's similar to the plot of my fanfiction, assuming I ever finish it lmao. But, of course, it would happen a bit differently in this roleplay, because writing the same story twice would be lame. To summarize my thoughts, I'm not particularly enamored with the forest territories or lake territories of the canon Clans- we done explored those. No, I want something new, somewhere we can take a fresh look at the Clans, their lifestyles and personalities, and what makes each one unique. I'm proposing that the Clans make a new Great Journey.
To be honest, it's not even just a matter of giving the Clans something to do- it also solves a lot of problems that new Clans tend to have, plus gives us a lot of creative leeway even within the canon. First and foremost, we can create a new and interesting territory as well as redefine what each Clan is all about. It also gives our characters something to do, not only for the first little bit of the roleplay but for a while. First, they need to be driven out of the current territories. Then, they need to make the journey. Then, they need to explore the new territory they reach and decide where they want to live. Then, they need to establish camps, fight over borders, and do all that fun stuff. And then, they'll probably still be discovering new things for moons upon moons after the fact. Besides that, it also gives a possible explanation for why there wouldn't be a lot of cats in the Clans at the beginning of the roleplay- essentially, some sort of disaster (presumably, the same one that drove them from their home) claimed the lives of most cats in the Clan, reducing the numbers. That also means that when they reach their new home, the Clans might seek to bolster their numbers by adopting non-Clan cats into the Clans, which, for at least a little while, would mean it would be a lot easier for outsiders to get in and thus introduce new characters with no tie to the current story without it being narratively awkward. Essentially, if the roleplay can actually survive such an intense plot, I don't see a way that narrative could go wrong. But, it's up for debate. While I'm pretty infatuated with this idea, it's not set in stone, so if we could come up with something equally as exciting, I'm all ears.
So, would anyone be interested in a roleplay like this? Is anyone interested in creating one or more of the Clans (though, I'm thinking max of two per person) or just moderating them? Or, helping out in other ways (banners and the like). I'm sure there will be plenty to do....
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Post by Gargoyle on Jul 25, 2018 7:38:29 GMT -5
The Clans
Main Plot Ideas
- The Second Great Journey: a flood from moons of rain and a broken dam upstream completely submerges the territory, kills of most of the cats, and forces the Clans to decide to move away from the lake to a new territory.
Subplot Ideas - Population & Power: once the Clans have settled into their new territories, they'll want to re-establish their power and strength. That, of course, means that they need to restore their populations, as not many cats are left alive after the flood. So, the Clans might be more willing to adopt outsiders, but they also want Clan-born kits as well. Thus, many cats are pressured into taking mates and having kits even though they might not be ready to raise a litter of their own. Some Clans might resort to pairing up its members who are having difficulty finding mates on their own, or stealing kits from outside the Clans and raising those kits to believe that they are Clan-born.
- No New Moon: when the flood destroys the territories, it floods the Moonpool as well, blocking all access the Clans have to their ancestors. This proves to be a problem, as some of the Clan leaders were killed, and thus those chosen as their successors have no way of gaining their nine lives in preparation for the journey. Once the Clans reach the new territory, it proves far more difficult than anyone anticipated to find a new sacred place, meaning that even once they've settled in, no new leader is able to gain their lives. This is the case for many, many moons, until none of the original Clan leaders remain and none of the current leaders have nine lives. This is the case for a while, and just as cats begin to think that this is merely the new status quo, and that the tradition of leaders gaining their nine lives is over, a new sacred area is discovered. It has been so long by this time, however, that cats question whether they even should continue the tradition of the nine lives.
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Post by Gargoyle on Jul 25, 2018 7:38:39 GMT -5
reserve
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Post by lazy penguin on Jul 25, 2018 11:15:04 GMT -5
(Yes, yes, yes! I love this idea.
I have always wanted to be a part of an active original clan rp, but the ones I usually join die off within the first week. Which is sad, cause they're a lot of fun.
I can own a clan if you need, but I'm also fine with just being a mod or a member, whichever works best for you.
I can help out with coding and stuff (particularly banners and headers), if you needed help with that. If you need an example of my work, I have a camp half-blood rp in otrp that you can check out?
What else were you wanting to discuss, cause I'm down for anything really!)
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Post by monarch on Jul 25, 2018 11:36:01 GMT -5
(I love this whole concept! I've always wanted to be a part of an original clan rp, but have never found one that hasn't burnt out. I would love to own a clan and help in anyway I can! I'm not particularly good at coding or anything but maybe I could help with the layout of territory or landmarks?)
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Post by Jas on Jul 25, 2018 12:22:13 GMT -5
Hello there, I really love the idea you've come up with and I would very much love to be a part of it. I can roleplay at an advanced level and would be willing to type up an example or post a few if you would like. Along with that, I know how to code and I can make banners/graphics. There's an old shop up here still. But I'm totally fine with letting someone else take over the designing process. cx It's a lot of work! If possible, I would like to lead ShadowClan. It's always been my favorite Clan.
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Post by Gargoyle on Jul 25, 2018 18:27:13 GMT -5
Sorry for the vanish, due to work I have to sleep during the day ^^ anyways, I did do a bit of snooping on all of you (sorry, not sorry lol) and I think you'll all be good fits! So, that's ShadowClan for Jas... you said you would be interested in running a Clan as well, monarch? What about you lazy penguin?
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Post by Armageddidn't on Jul 25, 2018 18:29:42 GMT -5
This actually sounds interesting! I'd be interested in running possibly Shadowclan, but I'd need specific requirements.
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Post by Jas on Jul 25, 2018 18:32:25 GMT -5
Snoop all you'd like And no worries. I've gotten into a bad habit of staying up late and sleeping half the day away haha.
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Post by lazy penguin on Jul 25, 2018 19:11:29 GMT -5
(Honestly though, I snoop on people all the time so kein stress!
I don't really have a preference for which clan, though I do have experience in running a RiverClan rp so maybe them. )
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Post by Gargoyle on Jul 25, 2018 23:14:42 GMT -5
Sorry Armageddidn't but Cas got to ShadowClan first! And if penguin takes RiverClan then that leaves ThunderClan and SkyClan.
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Post by Jas on Jul 25, 2018 23:43:19 GMT -5
Since the fire was used previously in canon, we could say that a long season of unseasonable rain and humidity made the territory uninhabitable. I'm almost certain this place isn't where monsoons happen lol, but it's fantasy so!... Multiple monsoons with little to no relief could have made the area too mushy, potentially flooded out RiverClan's camp / whole territory. Filled up ThunderClan's camp with enough water to make dens unlivable. Possibly even forced ShadowClan to leave their territory as well since it was already marshy, now it would be like quicksand haha. Trees and bushes could be falling from the soft earth and crashing into other trees -- the forests are just turning into huge messes. Prey is getting drowned and/or trapped in mud, making a good chunk of it inedible. There are little to no herbs now as well. I'd imagine this would bring on a lot of coughs as well, possibly even pneumonia for some.
I have too many ideas.
I'm not sure where SkyClan lives in this scenario, but this would force all of the Clans to find refuge within the higher parts of WindClan/ThunderClan territories.
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Post by Gargoyle on Jul 26, 2018 1:27:10 GMT -5
Hmmm... Not a bad idea... But how about a slight alteration...
Maybe something like in the Fourth Apprentice where there was the beaver dam that sort of blocked the water? But like, the opposite instead. Like, there's a dam somewhere upstream of one or more of the streams that feed into the lake and heavy rains cause it to break (the cats probably don't know all this though), which releases the water and causes the lake and the streams connected to the dam to flash flood. Which would probably be far more destructive, since it would be so sudden and so extreme. There would be no time to prepare or adjust. Suddenly, most of the territory is just covered in water and it keeps coming. The Clans probably try to wait it out for SOME time, hoping that the water will recede, but pretty quickly realize it isn't going to any time soon and know that if what few of them are left are going to survive they need to get far away from the water.
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Post by Jas on Jul 26, 2018 1:51:51 GMT -5
That's more plausible~ I like that idea even better cx
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Post by Gargoyle on Jul 26, 2018 7:52:10 GMT -5
Tbh the more I think about it the more I like the flood concept (however it comes about). Like, it's just so hopelessly and permanently destructive that it would really force the Clans to move- as in, unless the twolegs build a new dam at some point (which would likely take years) the water isn't gonna go down and that territory is just gone. There's no waiting for it to recover, like with a fire where in a few moons the greenery will start to come back and so will the prey. There's no waiting this one out; they just, have to leave, or they'll keep suffering indefinitely. And like, especially at first, it's not just one bout of destruction and done. The flash flood would happen and wipe out all the territory closest to the lake and the streams where the water came from, but then with nowhere to drain the water would just keep rising too. So the survivors would gather near the edge of the water to recuperate... and then the water level would rise... and they'd have to move again... and that would probably just repeat a few times. Some cats might even think that the world is just straight up ending, Noah's Ark style. I imagine that cats might also be really paranoid/superstitious about large bodies of water, flooding of any kind, and heavy rains for moons or even generations to come.
Interestingly enough, I also feel like RiverClan would be the one to suffer the most from this scenario, long-term at least. I can imagine that the RiverClan cats would feel humiliated and even somewhat betrayed- after all, the water is literally what they base their entire lives around, and yet as soon as it became destructive they were just as helpless as everyone else. I could even see some RiverClan cats perhaps rejecting the water entirely after that. Some cats in the other Clans might blame them as well, even though it's obviously not their fault. Maybe feeling that their relationship with the water meant they somehow caused the incident, or else meant that they should have seen signs that it was coming, or whatever. Essentially, being somewhat blamed (even indirectly) for the outcome of the disaster, even though realistically there was nothing they could have known or done. It might be an interesting plot point to see a Clan other than ShadowClan be the ones unfairly villainized, even if only indirectly/unintentionally.
As a side note, I also have another subplot for the future thought out, which might be interesting. Basically that, once the Clans settle into their new territories, they decide that they need to boost their numbers and of course they want their populations to primarily be increased by kits born into the Clans. Mainly either by encouraging young cats to take mates and have kits (and one or more Clans maybe even pairing up its members to sort of expedite the process? Hmmm) or even by stealing kits from outside the Clans (kittypets/loners/rogues) and raising the kits (and lying to the other Clans) that the kits are Clan-born. It would definitely be a way the Clans could try to "show off" how well they're settling into their new territories, since obviously more surviving kits means that they must be doing well, plus more strong, loyal, and Clan-born (whether they're actually Clan-born or not) warriors would certainly make the Clan at least appear more powerful once the kits grew up. Plus, I'm sure the older cats in the Clan, from before the disaster, would have grown up accustomed to a large, secure Clan, and might dislike the small population, so getting their Clans' numbers back up would just be a way to sort of make things "normal" again, or closer to "how they used to be." Idk, it's definitely still very far off, but it popped into my head and I felt like it could be a way to not only include a lot of relationship drama, but also some intrigue (kit-stealing as well as using kit survival rates as a political move/display of power), and some unique family dynamics, particularly between kits and the parents who may not have been emotionally prepared to raise them. It's a subplot to really discuss in detail later when it gets closer to that time, but I figured I'd mention it now since I thought of it.
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Post by Armageddidn't on Jul 26, 2018 11:23:10 GMT -5
I'll go with Skyclan then!
Also, the flood idea sounds fun, but also somewhat morbid? Like, someone could easily describe in detail what the drowning cat is feeling and thinking. and that someone might be me bcuz i've drowned so many of my characters...
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Post by lazy penguin on Jul 26, 2018 11:31:01 GMT -5
I'm also really digging the flood concept! It's sudden enough that you don't have to do a ton of set up for it, so it makes sense from a mechanical set up too. If things start to slow down and people are getting bored then, *bam* you can start the plot. Plus it lets everyone be involved, because literally any cat could be out and about when the flood happens.
I really like how this plot could also affect RiverClan. Like I was planning on making a leader who was really religious, so he might see the flood as a sign from StarClan. Maybe he'll like renounce water as a whole, stripping the clan of it's identity. So like he doesn't want his cats swimming and fishing anymore, and wants them to learn how to hunt on dry land. Kinda like how Heatherstar got rid of tunnelers? But a lot more extreme. So we could play with that idea.
It also could play a part in where the clans end up settling. So like maybe they try to settle in places without large bodies of water or large rivers, but none of the areas can support enough prey and herbs for five clans. So they have to learn to like, trust water again? That kinda sounds dumb but idk, just a fun concept.
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Post by Jas on Jul 26, 2018 12:19:52 GMT -5
Yeah, I agree. It seems like the perfect solution and really, at that point, no one could feasibly decide to stay behind. Even the eldest characters that may not particularly want to go on a long journey will have to. This could end in their deaths, which would have been expected either way, but it could also end in their triumph. Maybe a couple of elders in the Clans actually make it through the journey. A little bit of light amidst all of the darkness. I feel like ShadowClan would be the most apt to go around stealing kits. I don't know how well stealing from another Clan would go, but stealing from twoleg place would definitely be doable. This could also lead to some clan cats getting trapped with twolegs. lazy penguinI really love that idea and wholly support that. I think that would be so interesting to read and roleplay through.
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Post by kiwi cheesecake on Jul 26, 2018 17:38:20 GMT -5
(I'd be willing to host a clan! Maybe Thunder??)
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Post by Gargoyle on Jul 26, 2018 19:42:44 GMT -5
Haruhi, sorry to say but looking through your posts and threads, I'm not quite sure your style and level is what I'm looking for to run or moderate a Clan. You're more than welcome to join and to help plan, but I'm trying to find relatively advanced roleplayers to actually make and moderate the threads. Sorry. kiwi cheesecake , sounds good to me.
lazy penguin, that would be neat. Obviously, we couldn't have RiverClan forsake the water permanently, but having them as a Clan sort of "lose their identity" for a time could be cool. I could see the Clans choosing to settle somewhere without a single major body of water, or avoiding whatever body of water there might be, and RiverClan suffering for it over time. Until maybe like, the next generation or the next leader or whatever is like "okay enough is enough we gotta go back to the water."
As for kit-stealing, yeah, ShadowClan is as always the most likely to resort to that... but really any Clan could come up with similarly desperate solutions if they feel they're not doing well enough to repopulate on their own, or if they feel the other Clans might get too much of an advantage over them. So while not all Clans might resort quite to stealing kits, I'm definitely interested in seeing whatever solutions the other Clans manage to come up with lol.
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Post by lazy penguin on Jul 26, 2018 20:35:56 GMT -5
Awesome!
So what do you need help with at the moment?
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Post by Jas on Jul 26, 2018 20:54:35 GMT -5
I'm going all in on this sub plot haha. We still have main plot and layouts and territories to work out~
I was wondering, are we all making our own Clan page or is this going to be done on one page where each leader just posts a couple claims for their clan's allegiances? / possibly news.
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Post by kiwi cheesecake on Jul 26, 2018 20:56:12 GMT -5
I think it'd work better if we all had separate clan pages but like one universal joining/rules/general stuff page? If that makes sense.
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Post by kiwi cheesecake on Jul 26, 2018 20:58:50 GMT -5
also with this flood if the clans are moving we probably need to come up with the new territory?? which. yes. count me in for that. we don't need to do too much for old territory though. we could probably just edit some of the stuff from the wiki or that one extra book that had the cats take you on camp/territory tours(secrets of the clans? I think?). Whatever works though, we could also just write that ourselves.
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Post by Gargoyle on Jul 26, 2018 23:11:55 GMT -5
Yeah we probably won't need to worry too much about the current territory- just copy a description off the wiki and edit it however we need, pretty much. But that begs the question, WHEN is the roleplay gonna start? I was thinking probably around when the flood begins, so we can just launch into the plot. Plus, there's not much point in making and role-playing characters we know we're gonna kill off soon, unless you want to do that for dramatic effect (which is fine if you wanna do that). So, if we want to start during/after the flood, there's no point in even going into detail with the territories. If we want to start before, we should, but we don't need to get too detailed with it bc it won't last.
As for the pages, the idea was that each Clan would have it's own page. However, obviously all cats will be together for the journey, which means either we won't need separate pages at first (if we start with the flood/journey) or that we'll specifically need a unified "journey" page where most roleplay will happen until the Clans find their new territory and the group separates back into Clans.
As for the new territory itself, I don't think we need to go into much detail with that atm either. A general description with areas more or less considered for each Clan, but I think it would be cool to figure out borders, landmarks, and other details when the cats start exploring in the roleplay. Also, sort of as a callback to the original forest territory (which was loosely based on a real place) it might be cool to base this territory (at least the general layout, not the details) on a real place, even if it's just one we find more or less at random on Google maps or something lol
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Post by Jas on Jul 27, 2018 0:10:51 GMT -5
I think starting when the Clans are trying to decide between staying or leaving would be best. That way we are getting right into the action and keeping people interested. We also wouldn't really need a description in my opinion. Just a simple "Lake territories are flooded and cats are gathering at x location." + describing how everything is under water and prey has drowned / disappeared.
Starting out with a simple journey page would mean we could start that at any point and then fine-tune the details amongst the leaders while also roleplaying. It would give us a little more time if we think of sudden ideas or changes to add on when it comes to territories, alliances, sub plots, etc.
I would also like to ask what this roleplay's view on LGBTQ+ characters is? Are we going by the books where it's not mentioned and generally assumed not to exist or are we having more freedom to choose?
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Post by Gargoyle on Jul 27, 2018 1:29:35 GMT -5
Yeah that's pretty much what I was thinking. It would give us time to gain members and thus more ideas before we settle entirely on the new territories. I figured if we start during/just after the flood, then we can have the cats meet back up somewhere and as people join, having to "find" the other survivors is a pretty good reason why they're just appearing, unlike in a normal clan where you typically just have to... pretend they weren't absent at the beginning.
As for LGBT+ characters, go for it! Personally I will probably be playing multiple non-straight characters. As for transgender/genderqueer, I would probably discourage that. Reason being that gender doesn't really play any role in cat life and for that matter I don't think the cats really even have a sense of gender. The ONLY difference in lifestyle that's present even in the books between toms and she-cats is that she-cats can bear and nurse kits and toms can't. So, there's not really anything for a transgender cat to change, other than our use of pronouns for them. There's not really any kind of struggle to transition or even physical dysphoria because, again, there's not any visible physical difference between toms and she-cats. So I feel like making a cat transgender/genderqueer doesn't really add to the story either as a whole or for that character. That said, if someone wanted to make a somewhat "nonbinary" cat that preferred gender neutral pronouns, I don't see an issue with that, because that's more for our benefit then for the cats and it's less of a "transition" than just... not especially identifying with a biological sex. But gay/bi cats... heck yeah go for it.
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Post by Gargoyle on Jul 27, 2018 22:08:18 GMT -5
For the sake of some more fun drama, I'm thinking it might be good if most of the Clan leaders are killed off in the flood, and probably a lot of their deputies as well, leaving the Clans without very many/any obvious leaders when it comes time to move. And the Moonpool is probably also flooded or otherwise inaccessible, which means that whatever cats might be chosen to be the next leaders will be unable to get their nine lives. In turn, this could mean that some of the new "leaders" will then also die on the journey, since they don't have multiple lives as a buffer against danger. It would be interesting, I think, for some of the Clans to have to go through multiple more-or-less unofficial leaders during the first part of the roleplay, maybe somewhat as a display of just how much is changing for them? Maybe by the time they actually settle in the new territory, none of the old leaders are left (those having survived the flood losing the rest of their lives on the journey?). And so there's like, a real struggle to find a new "sacred" place in the new territories so that the leaders can get their lives.
Hmmm, maybe it could even take them a really long time to find a new place to speak with StarClan? Even, like, a couple of years? So like, there's a long, long while where none of the leaders actually gain their nine lives. And then once everyone has almost started to forget about it, maybe feeling like that tradition is over... BAM. Someone finds a place. But it could be another interesting on-going struggle, almost Fountain of Youth-esque, where cats are continuously on the search for the sacred place but over time just lose more and more hope that they'll ever actually find somewhere. And then that could possibly be another struggle between the older generation and the new one, the one still having the same attachment to StarClan, their beliefs, and the old traditions (medicine cats meeting at the half moon, leaders getting nine lives, etc.) while the younger cats born in the new territory, without those traditions, might feel like they're overrated and struggle to accept them when the sacred place is finally discovered. Idk, maybe that would be too long, or too complicated, but it might be interesting.
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Post by kiwi cheesecake on Jul 28, 2018 13:41:17 GMT -5
I think if we wanted to do that the best place to start would be right before the floods? But I get it if you didn't want people to make characters just to die, and the idea of starting on one page to begin with is pretty great. It's just like if we start it at the beginning of the floods I feel like we could see who's hanging on to the hope of the old territories being saved, leaders dying(like you said), cats dying, probably some desperation, and then all the lead up to the move. I feel like that'd be stronger, in a sense, rather than just dropping everyone's characters in to a gathering and being like "We're moving." I'm not sure though, because I don't want it to take too long before the meeting to travel(since it looks like that'll be the focus of the rp based on the title change you made), and we could probably just write the flood stuff in backstories if we wanted to. Maybe randomly generate some cats who died, and people could have their cats be related or something?
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Post by lazy penguin on Jul 28, 2018 14:27:47 GMT -5
I agree with drea. I think we should start it right before the flood. It'll let people join and settle in before anything too extreme happens because like, I don't know about you guys, but I'm a little less likely to join something that's already starting a huge plot because I'm not sure how my characters will fit in. If we give everyone time to adjust, even if it's just like the first day or two, then I think we'll attract more people to join.
As for leaders and other important roles dying I'm down. For my RiverClan leader I had planned on him already being leader for a bit, so I might be more okay with a deputy/medicine cat/etc dying rather than having the old leader die and him take over. But like, I'm cool with anything really.
Them not having a moonpool is a cool plot too. Like maybe a deputy survives but the leader dies. And the deputy takes over for the journey, but dies before they could receive nine lives? Also the moonpool itself could be flooded, thus disrupting any contact between StarClan and the cats by the lake. Maybe it could be part of the reason that clans feel like they need to leave?
EDIT** also just realized you mention the moonpool flooding in your post, so yes. That. Good.
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