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Post by Noface on Jul 25, 2017 21:20:27 GMT -5
Nobody likes Brokenstar, everyone likes Scourge, Tigerstar, or Darktail.
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Post by Solarmyr on Jul 25, 2017 21:56:48 GMT -5
Frankly, I love Brokenstar as a villain. But compared to other villains in the series? We don't actually spend a great deal of time with him. He was sort of built up in Yellowfang's Secret, somewhat of a threat in the original arc, then he died. He didn't really do much after that, really. And thus he kinda got overshadowed by other villains who either lived longer, were more persistent or posed more of an immediate threat than he did.
Or at least that's my theory, anyway. :o
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#a3c5e6
Name Colour
𝓣𝓲𝓷𝓾𝓿𝓲𝓮𝓵
Warrior Fanatic
All hail me, the flower-flushing queen of Prague
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Post by 𝓣𝓲𝓷𝓾𝓿𝓲𝓮𝓵 on Jul 25, 2017 21:59:26 GMT -5
I never found Brokenstar to be interesting, but rather just a stereotypical, power-hungry villain. Molepelt claiming that he was destined to be evil—while an interesting concept—and his evil nature pretty much being hinted at the moment he was born doesn't help either.
Then again, I was never interested in Tigerstar, either.
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Post by Jaysnow on Jul 25, 2017 23:17:34 GMT -5
He was alright. But Darktail beats him. Also, why do these villains have such obviously villainous names?
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Post by Noface on Jul 26, 2017 2:53:57 GMT -5
Didn't Darktail die?
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Post by EthanTheAnnus on Jul 26, 2017 3:13:03 GMT -5
Scourge is my absolute favourite, but close behind him is Tigerstar, followed swiftly by Brokenstar. Let's give some reasons: Scourge was cruel, cunning and a great leader. He was so well thought out and the fact that all he needed was a small nudge from his siblings to make him resentful and then a larger nudge form Tigerpaw (Tigerstar) to make him hateful was brilliant.
Tigerstar was a wonderful villain too, manipulating others and almost succeeding in his plans on numerous occasions.
Finally, Brokenstar. I loved him because he was the first villain we ever saw in Warriors, and he was amazing. His backstory was great and training kits too young was his original idea. Tigerstar copied this idea when he overthrew ShadowClan, meaning Brokenstar was more ingenious than his evil successor.
Mapleshade and Darktail erk me.
Mapleshade, though her backstory was good, was too cliche (I mean, Graystripe and Bluestar had RiverClan lovers too) and she was waaay too overused.
Darktail was a great villain until we learn of his parentage. Though it was a small shock, it was too typical and we all got over the shock too quickly. It makes him such a similiar villain to Tigerstar, since they both had father problems, and quite frankly a bit boring. Onewhisker's relationship with Darktail's mother was obviously some sort of fling, and it just made another enemy for the Clans.
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me
Why did I name Me ?
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Post by me on Jul 26, 2017 7:09:49 GMT -5
Brokenstar was a good villain , but , he didn't appeared so much in the series , so we couldn't make a clear impression / ideea about him and his thoughts and plans as a villain. But , he was the first villain introduced in the series , then the Erins weren't very experimented about writing a cat villain .
And , about the three villains on which you listed :
Scourge : His manga was the best of all. His bakcstory maked the fans love him . His young age at which he become villain amazed the fans. He was a great leader , who maked BloodClan so strong.
Tigerstar : Even though new villains were introduced in the books, we need to be honest : Tiger was one of the best , I think I can say the best. Nobody can stop him. His reason to become evil were unclear , but his backstory and the way how the Erins write him was brilliant. His thirst for victory couln't be quenched. He was invincible. He manipuled so many cats , he caused so many deaths. I always hated the how he died :\ . They maked him to look like a weak.
Darktail : I don't read Avos yet.
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Post by Jei-Dinofelini on Jul 26, 2017 8:57:29 GMT -5
His prime time ended at end of Into The Wild... Later because a useless lump of fur as a prisoner so meh... Tigerstar was way better in my opinion ♡
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Post by ❅Maplefrost❅ on Jul 26, 2017 9:49:32 GMT -5
I just never personally found him to be that interesting but that doesn't mean he's not a good villain.
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Post by Basement Cat on Jul 26, 2017 12:45:43 GMT -5
Because he is a boring and bland character who was never fleshed out into more than generic bad guy. Not even in the DF, as he's still 'generic bad guy.' But at least he's not as bland as Thistleclaw.
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Post by Lightflame on Jul 26, 2017 13:08:22 GMT -5
He was way too incompetent. His most impressive moments where offscreen, and whenever he showed up, he failed, so he always felt like a loser. As well, his characterization was pretty boring.
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Post by ❅Maplefrost❅ on Jul 26, 2017 13:11:57 GMT -5
Because he is a boring and bland character who was never fleshed out into more than generic bad guy. Not even in the DF, as he's still 'generic bad guy.' But at least he's not as bland as Thistleclaw. Imo Thistle is more memorable than Brokenstar though, we got more of his character than Broken too...
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Post by Darkfang ☾ on Jul 26, 2017 15:47:10 GMT -5
Like others have said, we just didn't see that much of him. He was defeated in the first book. After reading YS he became more interesting but by then we'd met more complex villains so he didn't seem as interesting in comparison.
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Post by ❅Maplefrost❅ on Jul 26, 2017 19:18:04 GMT -5
I find Brokenstar was brilliant tbh. He seemed to influence lots of later villains like Tigerstar and Breezepelt and so on. Actually the one that influenced Tigerstar was Mapleshade, but Broken was the one that did influence Breeze, at least one of them.
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Post by Sea Drops by a Bird on Jul 26, 2017 21:14:34 GMT -5
Simply because we didn't see any of his villainy; we only saw his decline. With Tigerstar, we watched him rise to power, with Scourge we saw how much power he wielded and how coldly he did so. I haven't read anything after TLH so I don't know about Darktail. If Brokenstar had been given more time with us then we would probably see him as the biggest bad in the forest, but that wasn't his role in the story.
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Post by Pyropelt on Jul 26, 2017 21:44:00 GMT -5
Isn't Brokenstar the one who did horrible things to kits? Like with the hanging onto a tree by their teeth? And sending them into battle when they weren't even 6 moons old. I find it scary how he influenced and demanded ShadowClan warriors to train the kits. Plus he started a fight at the gathering if that counts? And killed Beetlewhisker and Ferncloud. I don't like him but I don't think he's underrated. It helps that we see more of him than other villians who are background characters.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 26, 2017 22:10:19 GMT -5
Brokenstar, in my opinion, wasn't very creative. I like cats that have an actual personality yet they still have a heart like Darktail, Scourge, Tigerstar, but Brokenstar felt nothing for his family members, not even for Yellowfang. While he did make Yellowfang's Secret a dark and intense story, he just never interested me. Brokenstar just felt like your typical "I'm the bad guy for this book" villain.
I like Tigerstar more because while he wasn't the best developed character and very, very predictable, he still had a bit of a personality. He's manipulative (EX: Getting others to train in the Dark Forest), he did care for his kits at one point in Tigerclaw's Fury, and even after he was exiled he still believed that ThunderClan didn't deserve to be burned alive. This showed that he still has a heart, despite all of the awful crimes he's done. This is why I like Tigerstar.. it's a shame he was ruined in OotS and stopped caring for his kits. He was like any other father, who'd want his kits with him for a moment. He was even grateful that Fireheart saved Bramblekit's life.
I loathe her, but at least Mapleshade had a reason to be evil. We pretty much all know her story and she is a pretty interesting villain, even if her backstory wasn't handled right. She uses a motherly personality to hide her true self, to let others feel comfortable around her. This is how she managed to gain Crookedstar's trust, to manipulate him and she was there when he needed support. She took advantage of his issues with Rainflower and acted gentle, but on the inside, she was a monster. Crookedstar was even confused when Goosefeather tried to warn him about her, that fate shouldn't be played with like a toy. But again, it's a shame her good character was wasted when Mapleshade's Vengeance came out.
Thistleclaw, while I don't care for him, he had a decent personality. He was shown to be arrogant and wanted power, but he had a soft side and cared for Snowfur. Snowfur was able to control that ambition, it's been shown that he does indeed love her. Now how often do we see a villain that loves someone? Not so much. He only really snapped when Snowfur died, and grew worse. We got to see the gentle side of Thistleclaw in Spottedleaf's Heart, his hunger for blood in Crookedstar's Promise, which showed that he at least had a decent personality.
I can't remember other villains that had a decent personality at the moment, but this is why I never cared for Brokenstar. He's just your typical "I want to kill cats for fun and gain power" villain. He's not interesting, he never really had a reason to be evil besides having an abusive mother, whereas at least cats like Mapleshade and even Tigerstar and Thistleclaw had decent reasons. Comparing Brokenstar to other villains, he's very bland. I never liked him from the start when I first read this series. Just not enough to have an opinion on him.
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Post by Card against Humanity on Jul 26, 2017 22:41:40 GMT -5
I never found Brokenstar to be interesting, but rather just a stereotypical, power-hungry villain. Molepelt claiming that he was destined to be evil—while an interesting concept—and his evil nature pretty much being hinted at the moment he was born doesn't help either. Then again, I was never interested in Tigerstar, either. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Also, Brokenstar was only a major villain for one book, unlike, say, Tigerstar, who was more of a series villain
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Post by ❅Maplefrost❅ on Jul 27, 2017 1:41:15 GMT -5
Brokenstar, in my opinion, wasn't very creative. I like cats that have an actual personality yet they still have a heart like Darktail, Scourge, Tigerstar, but Brokenstar felt nothing for his family members, not even for Yellowfang. While he did make Yellowfang's Secret a dark and intense story, he just never interested me. Brokenstar just felt like your typical "I'm the bad guy for this book" villain. I was always a bit....well....I felt that when he killed his own father, it felt "off"? Like it's as if the Erins wrote him with no heart, no personality out of all that want for power and blood shed, he was the typical villain. I thought he at least had feeling for his father, but apparently not if he's so willing to kill him just like that after becoming deputy??? It made no sense to me, especially after all the drama the Erins emphasized with Hal and Ragged. I can understand, even if it's wrong, why Ragged killed his father, he was a crappy dad, that treated his mother and him like nothing, and a bad memory, and even had another family back at his home; Russetfur. Ragged had more personality as an anti-villain than Broken did as a villain....
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Post by Deleted on Jul 27, 2017 11:20:00 GMT -5
Brokenstar, in my opinion, wasn't very creative. I like cats that have an actual personality yet they still have a heart like Darktail, Scourge, Tigerstar, but Brokenstar felt nothing for his family members, not even for Yellowfang. While he did make Yellowfang's Secret a dark and intense story, he just never interested me. Brokenstar just felt like your typical "I'm the bad guy for this book" villain. I was always a bit....well....I felt that when he killed his own father, it felt "off"? Like it's as if the Erins wrote him with no heart, no personality out of all that want for power and blood shed, he was the typical villain. I thought he at least had feeling for his father, but apparently not if he's so willing to kill him just like that after becoming deputy??? It made no sense to me, especially after all the drama the Erins emphasized with Hal and Ragged. I can understand, even if it's wrong, why Ragged killed his father, he was a crappy dad, that treated his mother and him like nothing, and a bad memory, and even had another family back at his home; Russetfur. Ragged had more personality as an anti-villain than Broken did as a villain.... Wasn't it even shown in the book itself that Brokenstar might have loved his father? This is why I just never cared for him... he should have at least loved someone in his life, seems unrealistic and boring to make him totally heartless.
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Post by kestrelstrike on Jul 27, 2017 11:30:27 GMT -5
Brokenstar was only a threat for a short time. plus he was just generally boring.
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Post by Tas on Jul 27, 2017 11:41:37 GMT -5
I like Sol ...
It's becoming kind of a theme I guess ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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